The Clown Prince of Crime
Super Freak
Re: Batgirl - Written, Directed and Produced by Joss Whedon
Batgirl The Movie
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Re: Batgirl - Written, Directed and Produced by Joss Whedon
Joker should be allowed to show fear, especially fear of death. He's human after all.
I don't think the Ledger Joker would be laughing if someone else foiled his plot and threw his ass off that building. Can't imagine him laughing if the mob teller or a GCPD officer got in a lucky shot.
Joker should be allowed to show fear, especially fear of death. He's human after all.
I don't think the Ledger Joker would be laughing if someone else foiled his plot and threw his ass off that building. Can't imagine him laughing if the mob teller or a GCPD officer got in a lucky shot.
The Clown Prince of Crime
Super Freak
Re: Batgirl - Written, Directed and Produced by Joss Whedon
Hmm...the fearless Joker has been done before in the comics, like in TDKR, when he kills himself and laughs. Or the time Scarecrow sprayed him with fear gas, and it had no effect on him.
I'm not sure when it started, but I do prefer a fearless Joker. That's become a recurrent trait in modern comics and in the animated movies and video games. It's almost like his superpower along with his superhuman tolerance to pain...in the comics. In a way, a Joker who feels fear is probably more grounded and realistic...which is ironic, considering the "grounded" Joker in TDK is the least human in that regard.
As far as Ledger's version not wanting to get killed by someone else other than Batman, it depends, he had no problem with Harvey killing him either. I don't think the Joker (TDK) would laugh if the bank teller killed him, but I don't think he was hiding from him out of fear either. To him it's probably some kind of game, and he's not going to let someone unworthy beat him. It has more to do with pride and his ego than fear probably.
Hmm...the fearless Joker has been done before in the comics, like in TDKR, when he kills himself and laughs. Or the time Scarecrow sprayed him with fear gas, and it had no effect on him.
I'm not sure when it started, but I do prefer a fearless Joker. That's become a recurrent trait in modern comics and in the animated movies and video games. It's almost like his superpower along with his superhuman tolerance to pain...in the comics. In a way, a Joker who feels fear is probably more grounded and realistic...which is ironic, considering the "grounded" Joker in TDK is the least human in that regard.
As far as Ledger's version not wanting to get killed by someone else other than Batman, it depends, he had no problem with Harvey killing him either. I don't think the Joker (TDK) would laugh if the bank teller killed him, but I don't think he was hiding from him out of fear either. To him it's probably some kind of game, and he's not going to let someone unworthy beat him. It has more to do with pride and his ego than fear probably.
Re: Batgirl - Written, Directed and Produced by Joss Whedon
Ledger joker didnt have fear when falling because falling by batmans hands would complete his plan.
But he sure as hell was afraid when the swat team when to get him. His laughter became crying when they were pulling him in.
Hmm...the fearless Joker has been done before in the comics, like in TDKR, when he kills himself and laughs. Or the time Scarecrow sprayed him with fear gas, and it had no effect on him.
I'm not sure when it started, but I do prefer a fearless Joker. That's become a recurrent trait in modern comics and in the animated movies and video games. It's almost like his superpower along with his superhuman tolerance to pain...in the comics. In a way, a Joker who feels fear is probably more grounded and realistic...which is ironic, considering the "grounded" Joker in TDK is the least human in that regard.
As far as Ledger's version not wanting to get killed by someone else other than Batman, it depends, he had no problem with Harvey killing him either. I don't think the Joker (TDK) would laugh if the bank teller killed him, but I don't think he was hiding from him out of fear either. To him it's probably some kind of game, and he's not going to let someone unworthy beat him. It has more to do with pride and his ego than fear probably.
Ledger joker didnt have fear when falling because falling by batmans hands would complete his plan.
But he sure as hell was afraid when the swat team when to get him. His laughter became crying when they were pulling him in.
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Re: Batgirl - Written, Directed and Produced by Joss Whedon
Don't get me wrong, I do like that laugh in the face of death. It makes sense in that moment because he thinks he broke Batman. I also like that comic where Scarecrow gasses him but it doesn't work.
But if he becomes this inhuman entity that isn't afraid of anything, like an invincible god or something, I don't know, that just doesn't seem real. I actually like that the animated series Joker is about to **** his pants when Charlie Collins is about to one up him, or the realization that he's about to get eaten by a shark, or beaten to death by Harley. Or getting pissed that he's about to get swindled out of cash like the Joker's Millions. If he doesn't have any emotions and is completely nihilistic, well that makes the Joker pretty dull imo. That's one of the things that starts to annoy me about the Ledger Joker overtime. It's like he's written by a moody, edgy, teenager. "He's just an agent of chaos, doesn't care bout money or nuffin'!" Factor in Joker never getting wounded or bleeding and he comes off as a one dimensional cartoon character,
I'd like to imagine a meaningless, throw away death without a punchline or being tossed aside and completely forgotten would be the Joker's greatest fear. Even Ledger's.
I don't think Nicholson Joker comes off as a little ***** for screaming on the way down. He genuinely thought he had the last laugh and was on his way to freedom. The weight of the gargoyle ripping at his leg couldn't have been very pleasant either.
Don't get me wrong, I do like that laugh in the face of death. It makes sense in that moment because he thinks he broke Batman. I also like that comic where Scarecrow gasses him but it doesn't work.
But if he becomes this inhuman entity that isn't afraid of anything, like an invincible god or something, I don't know, that just doesn't seem real. I actually like that the animated series Joker is about to **** his pants when Charlie Collins is about to one up him, or the realization that he's about to get eaten by a shark, or beaten to death by Harley. Or getting pissed that he's about to get swindled out of cash like the Joker's Millions. If he doesn't have any emotions and is completely nihilistic, well that makes the Joker pretty dull imo. That's one of the things that starts to annoy me about the Ledger Joker overtime. It's like he's written by a moody, edgy, teenager. "He's just an agent of chaos, doesn't care bout money or nuffin'!" Factor in Joker never getting wounded or bleeding and he comes off as a one dimensional cartoon character,
I'd like to imagine a meaningless, throw away death without a punchline or being tossed aside and completely forgotten would be the Joker's greatest fear. Even Ledger's.
I don't think Nicholson Joker comes off as a little ***** for screaming on the way down. He genuinely thought he had the last laugh and was on his way to freedom. The weight of the gargoyle ripping at his leg couldn't have been very pleasant either.
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The Clown Prince of Crime
Super Freak
Re: Batgirl - Written, Directed and Produced by Joss Whedon
I forgot to add, one of my favorite versions of the Joker is the Capullo/Snyder version from Death of the Family and Endgame.
In both stories, the Joker seemed to be scared at the end, which was interesting.
In Death of the Family, Batman tells Joker that he knows who he really is, and as he's about to tell him, Joker seems to be afraid to hear him say it.
The best part is when Bruce reveals that Joker knows Batman's identity, but doesn't care.
Then there is Endgame, and at the end Joker shows some fear of death, when he was trying to escape, but Batman wouldn't let him.
I guess it depends on the writer, and how it's done.
I forgot to add, one of my favorite versions of the Joker is the Capullo/Snyder version from Death of the Family and Endgame.
In both stories, the Joker seemed to be scared at the end, which was interesting.
In Death of the Family, Batman tells Joker that he knows who he really is, and as he's about to tell him, Joker seems to be afraid to hear him say it.
The best part is when Bruce reveals that Joker knows Batman's identity, but doesn't care.
Then there is Endgame, and at the end Joker shows some fear of death, when he was trying to escape, but Batman wouldn't let him.
I guess it depends on the writer, and how it's done.
Re: Batgirl - Written, Directed and Produced by Joss Whedon
One thing's certain: my Nicholson Joker looks a lot better on the shelf than my Ledger Joker.
When you go too real, you take the fantasy right out.
One thing's certain: my Nicholson Joker looks a lot better on the shelf than my Ledger Joker.
When you go too real, you take the fantasy right out.
The Clown Prince of Crime
Super Freak
Re: Batgirl - Written, Directed and Produced by Joss Whedon
Yes, the fight was brutal. They destroyed each other. Joker even carved a giant smiley face on Batman's back with two large knives as the eyes. Batman destroyed the Joker's face and bit off his ear in anger too. Joker also burned Batman's mouth.
Yes, the fight was brutal. They destroyed each other. Joker even carved a giant smiley face on Batman's back with two large knives as the eyes. Batman destroyed the Joker's face and bit off his ear in anger too. Joker also burned Batman's mouth.
Re: Batgirl - Written, Directed and Produced by Joss Whedon
The problem with Snyder's "Slasher" Joker is that he loses his appeal. He becomes another gross, hyper-violent maniac that appeals to the "edgy" crowd. Morrison set the stage for that, with his HyPERsanITy version, but Snyder just went full-on "Killer Clown". I've said it before, but the ideal, for me at least, Joker should be a Dean Martin/Frank Sinatra-esque character. Still a villain, and sometimes a maniac, but one that operates with style alongside a certain '50s flavor. Coat, hat, vest, all of that jazz. Joker's charm comes from being sometimes aloof and goofy. Turn him into a complete monster and... eh. I'd rather they keep Joker a tad "campier" and turn someone like, say, Professor Pyg into the "coMPletE manIAc".
That was a good fight. Honestly, since Johns did the 3 Jokers thing, they should go ahead and make Snyder's Joker Gelos. Classic Joker the Comedian, and Old-School Joker a harmless jokester.
The problem with Snyder's "Slasher" Joker is that he loses his appeal. He becomes another gross, hyper-violent maniac that appeals to the "edgy" crowd. Morrison set the stage for that, with his HyPERsanITy version, but Snyder just went full-on "Killer Clown". I've said it before, but the ideal, for me at least, Joker should be a Dean Martin/Frank Sinatra-esque character. Still a villain, and sometimes a maniac, but one that operates with style alongside a certain '50s flavor. Coat, hat, vest, all of that jazz. Joker's charm comes from being sometimes aloof and goofy. Turn him into a complete monster and... eh. I'd rather they keep Joker a tad "campier" and turn someone like, say, Professor Pyg into the "coMPletE manIAc".
That was a good fight. Honestly, since Johns did the 3 Jokers thing, they should go ahead and make Snyder's Joker Gelos. Classic Joker the Comedian, and Old-School Joker a harmless jokester.
The Clown Prince of Crime
Super Freak
Re: Batgirl - Written, Directed and Produced by Joss Whedon
Do you think The Joker should feel fear?
I'm against it most of the time. This was funny though.
3:18 when Ace (ironic) mind **** him
I think the Joker's lack of fear in TDK is great because that's Batman's main weapon against criminals, but now he's come across someone he can't intimidate of scare, so he becomes powerless, and as a result he has to change his approach.
Do you think The Joker should feel fear?
I'm against it most of the time. This was funny though.
3:18 when Ace (ironic) mind **** him
I think the Joker's lack of fear in TDK is great because that's Batman's main weapon against criminals, but now he's come across someone he can't intimidate of scare, so he becomes powerless, and as a result he has to change his approach.
batfan08
Super Freak
Re: Batgirl - Written, Directed and Produced by Joss Whedon
My Joker is a guy who has a capacity for brutality, but he also conducts himself within certain confines. He's the guy who keeps looking over his desk, pissed off, at his henchmen playing poker, recalling how he overheard one of them say he had a screw loose. Then thinking it would be funny if he grabbed a power drill and a long screw, walked over to the table where they're playing, and drilled it right into the guy's head.
Similarly, he's the guy who will hide out in your house in the suburbs waiting out the cops, have you and your family bound, gagged, and pissing yourselves in fear, playing all sorts of mind games making you think you and your loved ones are going to die, and then he'll thank you for being such fun hosts and taking his mind off things before giving you each a share in his loot and going off on his way.
My Joker is a guy who has a capacity for brutality, but he also conducts himself within certain confines. He's the guy who keeps looking over his desk, pissed off, at his henchmen playing poker, recalling how he overheard one of them say he had a screw loose. Then thinking it would be funny if he grabbed a power drill and a long screw, walked over to the table where they're playing, and drilled it right into the guy's head.
Similarly, he's the guy who will hide out in your house in the suburbs waiting out the cops, have you and your family bound, gagged, and pissing yourselves in fear, playing all sorts of mind games making you think you and your loved ones are going to die, and then he'll thank you for being such fun hosts and taking his mind off things before giving you each a share in his loot and going off on his way.
The Clown Prince of Crime
Super Freak
Re: Batgirl - Written, Directed and Produced by Joss Whedon
My Joker is a guy who has the capacity to drop a mean beat and get much love from all his niccas in Crime Alley.
My Joker is a guy who has the capacity to drop a mean beat and get much love from all his niccas in Crime Alley.
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Re: Batgirl - Written, Directed and Produced by Joss Whedon
you just described the 10 minutes we've seen of this guy:
you just described the 10 minutes we've seen of this guy:
Re: Batgirl - Written, Directed and Produced by Joss Whedon
My joker is a guy that wears womens underwear and a diaper underneath his suit and has a secret crush on batman. A joker that sleeps with his henchmen just to show them who is boss.
A joker that wears make up because he likes crossdressing.
Thats a good joker
My joker is a guy that wears womens underwear and a diaper underneath his suit and has a secret crush on batman. A joker that sleeps with his henchmen just to show them who is boss.
A joker that wears make up because he likes crossdressing.
Thats a good joker
batfan08
Super Freak
Re: Batgirl - Written, Directed and Produced by Joss Whedon
The fact that you would associate that with Dean Martin and Frank Sinatra...I curse your name, Zach. I curse your family. I curse your home. I curse the world!
you just described the 10 minutes we've seen of this guy:
The fact that you would associate that with Dean Martin and Frank Sinatra...I curse your name, Zach. I curse your family. I curse your home. I curse the world!
The Clown Prince of Crime
Super Freak
Re: Batgirl - Written, Directed and Produced by Joss Whedon
I'd be scared of that Joker.
I'd be scared of that Joker.
Re: Batgirl - Written, Directed and Produced by Joss Whedon
Exactly. So would batman
Exactly. So would batman
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Re: Batgirl - Written, Directed and Produced by Joss Whedon
i was under the impression that he was talking about style, but hey if he wants an italian singer to star in a full length batman on ice feature film, i'd watch that too.
letoker gets a lot of hate, sure if you don't like him that's fine. but i think with more time then 6 weeks to write the character, and a different director can really make a good flick with letoker.
i was under the impression that he was talking about style, but hey if he wants an italian singer to star in a full length batman on ice feature film, i'd watch that too.
letoker gets a lot of hate, sure if you don't like him that's fine. but i think with more time then 6 weeks to write the character, and a different director can really make a good flick with letoker.
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Re: Batgirl - Written, Directed and Produced by Joss Whedon
so this?
hmmmm batman on ice or tranny miss(?) J, hard decision.
good thing you guys don't make these movies.
letoker>any other idea mentioned this far.
come at me bros. i can take it.
My joker is a guy that wears womens underwear and a diaper underneath his suit and has a secret crush on batman. A joker that sleeps with his henchmen just to show them who is boss.
A joker that wears make up because he likes crossdressing.
Thats a good joker
so this?
hmmmm batman on ice or tranny miss(?) J, hard decision.
good thing you guys don't make these movies.
letoker>any other idea mentioned this far.
come at me bros. i can take it.
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