Media Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain & Ground Zeroes

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I think if the game had a better initial price, it would have eased some of the complaints. Remember when I made a thread about it? :lol GZ really should have been $10 at regular price from the start. I still stand, that it's a great demo of TPP, but Konami shouldn't have overcharged for it. I know some people really like GZ. But, considering the radical changes in this game from the rest of the series, Kojima should have really tried to appease fans and gauge their reactions, instead of forcing those changes down our throats and expecting us to pay up.

But, at $6 to $10, it's a great game :lecture.
 
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I think if the game had a better initial price, it would have eased some of the complaints. Remember when I made a thread about it? :lol GZ really should have been $10 at regular price from the start. I still stand, that it's a great demo of TPP, but Konami shouldn't have overcharged for it. I know some people really like GZ. But, considering the radical changes in this game from the rest of the series, Kojima should have really tried to appease fans and gauge their reactions, instead of forcing those changes down our throats and expecting us to pay up.

But, at $6 to $10, it's a great game :lecture.
Yup, it's just that, a demo/prologue, charging that much for it was just stupid to begin with.

But! I am glad Kojima isn't being apologetic about the changes, some fans may dislike them but I've come to learn recently that pandering to the fans can end up terribly too, I'd rather have him doing whatever he wants with the series as long as he doesn't pull a major Lucas on us.

Sounds that way .

:huh elaborate
 
GZ is fun, and it did whet my appetite for Phantom Pain. But there are just so many things MGS that keep me from loving it the way I loved MGS1. The dog with an eyepatch, Quiet, Kiefer as Snake, The way they handled PAZ
second hidden bomb (in her privates? REALLY!?)
It just seems like for everything Kojima does right, he does 5 things wrong.... I feel like battered spouse syndrome with MGS at this point. It keeps abusing me but I keep coming back in hopes that it'll change for the better and be the game I fell in love with.
 
Nothing will ever be as good as MGS1, there's no novelty, no originality and none of the sparkle MGS1 came with, and that is ok, it doesn't mean the following games are bad, it just means MGS1 is that good.
 
I expected that reaction from Pliss, or even worse :lol but I think you were predisposed to not like it, Pliss.

Story in GZ was okay for what it was, it wasn't bad at all imo.

Can we all agree that this game wouldn't get so much flame here if it's price all along was $10 or $5? :lol

The gameplay is a lot of fun. I didn't really go into hating it, like you'd think since I've pretty much ignored MGS for quite some time now to be honest and I went into it fresh I would say.

The gameplay is fun, and I can see TPP being a blast. But just like with PW, the gameplay is the only thing I honestly could look forward to in it. I think the biggest thing that hurts GZ/TPP is that PW exists. I think it's a horrible setup to the book end to Big Boss's story.
 
Ground Zeroes made Chico and Paz a lot more likable, gameplay is great, and it really shows off what the Fox Engine is capable of, but I can't help feel that there were some features purposely omitted which really sucks considering the price of the game.

Personally I love Kiefer as Big Boss, he has that gravely, strong military authoritative voice I think Big Boss needs, but he also sounds normal enough to nail the dramatic scenes. Thankfully I never got into 24, so I don't hear Jack Bauer when he's talking, but if I did watch that show I would probably not like his voice as much either. It would be like James Gandolfini voicing Big Boss, I love him, but I would only hear Tony Soprano every time he would speak.

Im also glad the series seems to be stepping away from the animeish tone the previous games had to a more mature tone, feels like the series is aging with me.
 
i think thats the point why kiefers voice doesnt bother me so much. i never watch anything he does (or anything on tv for that matter), so i dont hear other characters in it. i am still very ******** about hayter not being big boss but can relate that big boss needs his own voice in the series and if hayter was solid again i would be overjoyed and would greatly overlook kiefers role as big boss.
 
Personally I love Kiefer as Big Boss, he has that gravely, strong military authoritative voice I think Big Boss needs, but he also sounds normal enough to nail the dramatic scenes. Thankfully I never got into 24, so I don't hear Jack Bauer when he's talking.
Kiefer definitely kills it as BB, I love his voice.

I started watching 24 and stopped at ep 6 of the 1st season due to lack of time (sorry Solidus, I'll finish it, I promise), and I have no problem separating both characters and their voices, it's just a mental block that happens often in voice acting, to this day I still find people who think Nathan Drake is voiced by Fillion.

Im also glad the series seems to be stepping away from the animeish tone the previous games had to a more mature tone, feels like the series is aging with me.
It does feel that way, but to be fair the anime-ish stuff was minimal in all the games, even TPP seems to have a normal amount, it's just PW the one that's so discrepant in that regard compared to the rest of the games.
 
As far as I know the dog is optional, most of the animeish stuff in TPP is, and it's still within the confines of what MGS1/2/4 did, no?

I didn't mean MGS is stepping away from animeish stuff, I mean to agree with P that it feels MGS is aging with me.
 
I expected that reaction from Pliss, or even worse :lol but I think you were predisposed to not like it, Pliss.

Story in GZ was okay for what it was, it wasn't bad at all imo.

Can we all agree that this game wouldn't get so much flame here if it's price all along was $10 or $5? :lol

I would have liked it better if I paid $60 for this demo but have gotten ZOE3 along side for free, which was exactly what they did for MGS2/ZOE1.
 
Anyway, my biggest problem with the tone of the game is the bipolar storytelling disorder vibe I'm getting. One moment Kojima seems to want to make his own Schindler's List, the next he's back to his awkward borderline nonsense. I'm all for a "dark and gritty" MGS, but you can only go ONE way, especially when depicting first hand the brutality of war. That was why I thought MGSV should have been a new IP instead.
 
I think if the game had a better initial price, it would have eased some of the complaints. Remember when I made a thread about it? :lol GZ really should have been $10 at regular price from the start. I still stand, that it's a great demo of TPP, but Konami shouldn't have overcharged for it. I know some people really like GZ. But, considering the radical changes in this game from the rest of the series, Kojima should have really tried to appease fans and gauge their reactions, instead of forcing those changes down our throats and expecting us to pay up.

But, at $6 to $10, it's a great game :lecture.
The price really is a problem, price can sometimes break a game if you don't get your money's worth. I'm also not too compelled with some of the game in general like the story at times. Nothing else bad about the game though that hasn't been said.
 
Anyway, my biggest problem with the tone of the game is the bipolar storytelling disorder vibe I'm getting. One moment Kojima seems to want to make his own Schindler's List, the next he's back to his awkward borderline nonsense. I'm all for a "dark and gritty" MGS, but you can only go ONE way, especially when depicting first hand the brutality of war. That was why I thought MGSV should have been a new IP instead.

At first, people were complaining that GZ was too dark, and let's be honest, it's really no darker than previous MGS games, the difference is that previous MGS games had darker undertones and things around the story & characters, while in GZ they are actually tones, not undertones, but it's really not touching on any new topics in that regard.

In TPP he said he added the humor because the game is too big, and the same serious tone all along would make the experience boring, which was a smart move, there's no reason why TPP can't swing from one side of the tone spectrum to the other, in fact, without the lightening of the tone and the constant seriousness the impactful moments would lose all traction.

It's not like some nonsense is gonna happen in a serious situation, c'mon, in MGS1 when you're waiting for your next torture session, there's a rotting corpse right next to you, how do you escape? With fake ketchup blood of course :lol
 
MGS had its dark moments honestly, MGS2's climax arguably was fairly dark at times like the true nature of the S3 simulation. And there's nothing really wrong with humor in dark or serious moments. Silent Hill's Dog ending anyone? :lol it just has to be appropriate at times.
 
Ground Zeroes made Chico and Paz a lot more likable, gameplay is great, and it really shows off what the Fox Engine is capable of, but I can't help feel that there were some features purposely omitted which really sucks considering the price of the game.

Personally I love Kiefer as Big Boss, he has that gravely, strong military authoritative voice I think Big Boss needs, but he also sounds normal enough to nail the dramatic scenes.Thankfully I never got into 24, so I don't hear Jack Bauer when he's talking, but if I did watch that show I would probably not like his voice as much either. It would be like James Gandolfini voicing Big Boss, I love him, but I would only hear Tony Soprano every time he would speak.

Im also glad the series seems to be stepping away from the animeish tone the previous games had to a more mature tone, feels like the series is aging with me.


:goodpost::exactly:

I agree with everything you said



Kiefer definitely kills it as BB, I love his voice.


Yes!

x6NGEPf.gif



It does feel that way, but to be fair the anime-ish stuff was minimal in all the games, even TPP seems to have a normal amount, it's just PW the one that's so discrepant in that regard compared to the rest of the games.

I think there was always animeish stuff, the behaviour of the charactes, the things they say etc. MGS1 was subtle but the rest of the games had heavy anime stuff (especially in MGS2 and 3) small details in the artistic design are very japanese like for example the effect the chaff grenades have looks just like petals falling, you won't see something like that in a western game.



I always liked anime, now that I think about it I don't find many big differences between the animes I've seen and Metal Gear, someone could make a great anime with this series:

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YZOZvzM.jpg


cBGEigR.jpg



If that was a real anime I would totally watch it ^^^ :lecture



At first, people were complaining that GZ was too dark, and let's be honest, it's really no darker than previous MGS games, the difference is that previous MGS games had darker undertones and things around the story & characters, while in GZ they are actually tones, not undertones, but it's really not touching on any new topics in that regard.

In TPP he said he added the humor because the game is too big, and the same serious tone all along would make the experience boring, which was a smart move, there's no reason why TPP can't swing from one side of the tone spectrum to the other, in fact, without the lightening of the tone and the constant seriousness the impactful moments would lose all traction.

It's not like some nonsense is gonna happen in a serious situation, c'mon, in MGS1 when you're waiting for your next torture session, there's a rotting corpse right next to you, how do you escape? With fake ketchup blood of course :lol

:exactly::goodpost::lecture

The BIG difference is that most of that **** is on tapes. Which makes sense if Kojima wanted to save time, people like to say thats poor story telling and its not that they are wrong... people prefer to see the story unfold

"show, don't tell"

GZ tells most of its story (but I believe that was just to save time and focus on TPP) the thing is, a growing trend among those with a negative view of the plot is criticizing the method of narrative in Ground Zeroes on the basis of its content. This is then used to argue that the player is "rewarded" with the actions depicted within the unlocked narrative :slap I guess anyone who gets far enough in Metal Gear Solid 2: Sons of Liberty will be "rewarded" with an attack on New York City eerily similar to the attack on the World Trade Center. Of course, these are not rewards but rather the development of plot.

You could say Chico's Tape 4 is a reward as it must be unlocked. True, it must be unlocked, much like how all video game storytelling is "unlocked" by completing the game through interaction, or the post-credits scene of several films are, in a way, "unlocked" after watching through the credits.

To call the specific depiction of sexual assault a "reward" though completely ignores how non-linear video games provide their narrative. The tapes simply expand on the narrative in a non-linear form that is only possible in video games







BTW have you guys seen what people is doing with GZ?

tumblr_nhdmb0Iru31qb0wv3o2_250.gif


tumblr_nhfr2a0sxZ1r2ydgto1_500.gif




:rotfl
 
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I don't get people trying to "separate" MGS from anime tropes. The stylistic action, the treatment of technology, the melodrama, the Eastern references, the whole "young generation fights against the problems caused by the previous generation", it's VERY Japanese in tone as an action series with an American re-skin and backdrop. Which isn't bad if you love anime as much as I do, but the notion of separating MGS from any concept of "anime" sounds a bit misguided. Sorry but Kojima's brand of childish humor =/= "anime". Childish humor may be prevalent in mainstream anime but that doesn't mean that there aren't any anime out there that deal with mature topics.

Heck if it weren't for MGS's "anime" direction, we wouldn't have gotten the fantastic ending of MGS2 which felt very in-line with a lot of anime that deal with existential topics.

On the other side of the argument though, I don't mind Kojima injecting some humor in TPP given its open-world format. I simply hope that he doesn't insert them when serious stuff is happening in the story that's related to BB's revenge, that's when it REALLY gets awkward.
 
Yeah, I'll give you that, ronri; Anime is in the very DNA of MGS. But, it gets a bit wonky when there are things like flying tanks, talking AIs, and Japanese karaoke in Peace Walker - which is a game that's set in Latin America. There was some really weird weeaboo **** going on in that game.
 
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