Star Wars: Episode IX - THE RISE OF SKYWALKER

[loki2371]

Re: Star Wars: Episode IX - December 20, 2019

But Holdo was in charge when the decision to abandon/evacuate the ship was made; she's the one who made it. Asking someone else to pilot it (again, even a droid- but especially Leia) and go down with the ship would have been cowardly and wrong. That's not how selfless leadership gets conveyed.

And I bet if they had Holdo turn over the piloting to a droid, then people would complain about her cowardice. She made the call, came up with the plan, and went down with the ship she ordered to be abandoned. I don't see how that doesn't make sense, but whatever.

I don't believe being smart is cowardice. Not when it is serving the greater good as opposed to being just a selfish act to save yourself.

The Resistance was pretty much wiped out. At this point, her duty should be to keeping the Resistance alive and save what was left, rather than sacrifice herself. Having a droid do it would show she outsmarted the First Order by destroying their ship while she and the Resistance survived. She would be needed if she was a powerful and influential person. Her life would serve better towards resurrecting the Resistance and convincing people to join, rather than to become a martyr for a cause, that apparently, few believed in as no one came to their call for aide. AS many have said, it should've been Ackbar who had survived till that point in the movie and made that decision to sacrifice himself. He deserved a noble death, not a casualty in a background explosion. But this was a movie about female empowerment, not male's being wise and in charge.

I am actually glad it was Holdo. I don't need nor want to see her ever again. One of the only positive moments in the movie was purple hair go bye bye. Now if only Rose had sacrificed herself to save Finn... And even that shows how clueless Johnson was. Holdo sacrifices herself in a bold maneuver to save the Resistance, then minutes later Finn tries to do the same and Rose tells him he's an idiot. I guess Rose thinks Holdo is an idiot too...

 

[loki2371]

Re: Star Wars: Episode IX - December 20, 2019

Should have been Ackbar and Leia going out together like Thelma & Louise, lol.

Or have Leia shut herself behind an airlock and tell Holdo: "I have been, and always shall be . . . your friend" Then she puts hand to glass as Holdo has to be dragged away.

Both of those would've been great.

 

[Khev]

Re: Star Wars: Episode IX - December 20, 2019

And then DJ and all the gamblers from Canto Bight show up to shoot off fireworks in honor of Holdo for no reason, lol.

Rose: "It's a Fathier Funeral."

 

[jye4ever]

Re: Star Wars: Episode IX - December 20, 2019

It should’ve been Ackbar that simple.

At first I thought Leia as well but no longer feel that way.

We didn’t know Holdo why should her sacrifice impact me in any way.

 

[Khev]

Re: Star Wars: Episode IX - December 20, 2019

In all seriousness I'm fine with it being Holdo (Dern's grim determination as she takes the controls really sells it for me) though if it were up to me I'd still lean toward having it be Leia.

 

[ajp4mgs]

Re: Star Wars: Episode IX - December 20, 2019

It should’ve been Ackbar that simple.

At first I thought Leia as well but no longer feel that way.

We didn’t know Holdo why should her sacrifice impact me in any way.

Yeah, having it be Ackbar would have been nice. But I think Holdo was created to have the Poe subplot play out. If Poe had defied Ackbar just to end up learning the same lesson, I think it would have made Poe look like an a-hole. With Holdo, her unfamiliarity, and her smugness, we don't resent Poe for defying her and her orders.

 

[xipotec]

Re: Star Wars: Episode IX - December 20, 2019

But Holdo was in charge when the decision to abandon/evacuate the ship was made; she's the one who made it. Asking someone else to pilot it (again, even a droid- but especially Leia) and go down with the ship would have been cowardly and wrong. That's not how selfless leadership gets conveyed.

And I bet if they had Holdo turn over the piloting to a droid, then people would complain about her cowardice. She made the call, came up with the plan, and went down with the ship she ordered to be abandoned. I don't see how that doesn't make sense, but whatever.

Yeah this....

Arguing with a disgruntled SW fan (especially after all this time) is tantamount to....

Sent from the inside of a giant slug in outer space.....

 

[Khev]

Re: Star Wars: Episode IX - December 20, 2019

Yeah, having it be Ackbar would have been nice. But I think Holdo was created to have the Poe subplot play out. If Poe had defied Ackbar just to end up learning the same lesson, I think it would have made Poe look like an a-hole. With Holdo, her unfamiliarity, and her smugness, we don't resent Poe for defying her and her orders.

You know if it weren't for Rose I might say that Poe comes out as the least likable character from the movie. His blabbing of the escape plan to Finn over the radio literally causes 80% of the Resistance and Holdo herself to die. He literally proved her right in needing to keep him out of the loop AND he was a **** about it.

Compare Poe to Cassian who didn't dare transmit to Yavin that they knew the Death Star's weakness for fear of it being intercepted by Imperials. But Poe blabs the entire plan when the entirety of the FO is visible to the naked eye. What a shmuck.

Does it break the movie or make me want KK's or RJ's head? No. The good still outweighs the bad by a significant margin IMO. But I can't say I'm a fan of Poe's arc in the film.

 

[loki2371]

Re: Star Wars: Episode IX - December 20, 2019

Yeah this....

Arguing with a disgruntled SW fan (especially after all this time) is tantamount to....

Sent from the inside of a giant slug in outer space.....

Pretty much the same as arguing with a TLJ lover and Johnson sympathizer, wouldn't you say??

 

[YoNoSe]

Re: Star Wars: Episode IX - December 20, 2019

Poe starts TFA as Leia’s #1 choice for her most important secret mission and allows himself to be captured and tortured to give BB-8 a head start.

TLJ: BLAH BLAH BLAH GUYS!

 

[xipotec]

Re: Star Wars: Episode IX - December 20, 2019

Pretty much the same as arguing with a TLJ lover and Johnson sympathizer, wouldn't you say??

Yup...


Sent from the inside of a giant slug in outer space.....

 

[xipotec]

Star Wars: Episode IX - December 20, 2019

However I still find it strange for people to spend so much time on a film they hate.

Sent from the inside of a giant slug in outer space.....

 

[ajp4mgs]

Re: Star Wars: Episode IX - December 20, 2019

You know if it weren't for Rose I might say that Poe comes out as the least likable character from the movie. His blabbing of the escape plan to Finn over the radio literally causes 80% of the Resistance and Holdo herself to die. He literally proved her right in needing to keep him out of the loop AND he was a **** about it.

Compare Poe to Cassian who didn't dare transmit to Yavin that they knew the Death Star's weakness for fear of it being intercepted by Imperials. But Poe blabs the entire plan when the entirety of the FO is visible to the naked eye. What a shmuck.

Does it break the movie or make me want KK's or RJ's head? No. The good still outweighs the bad by a significant margin IMO. But I can't say I'm a fan of Poe's arc in the film.

I think the Poe arc will have a better payoff if he's leading the Resistance in Episode IX. He was supposed to be a one-and-done throwaway character in TFA before JJ changed his mind and had him survive the TIE crash (yet had his jacket left in the cockpit but was nowhere to be found anywhere near the wreckage . . . somehow). With Carrie's untimely passing, the Resistance leadership has to be passed to someone else, so I think it's fortunate that we had a leadership-building arc for Poe in TLJ.

I get that you're irritated by his carelessness, but that worked well for me. He was an impulsive and reckless pilot who needed to understand the nuances of actual leadership. I still like Poe; he's probably my favorite of the new ST heroes.

As far as Ackbar goes, do we know if the actor who voiced him died during filming? If so, would that have played a role in Ackbar being written off so unceremoniously when the bridge was attacked?

 

[xipotec]

Re: Star Wars: Episode IX - December 20, 2019

I think the Poe arc will have a better payoff if he's leading the Resistance in Episode IX. He was supposed to be a one-and-done throwaway character in TFA before JJ changed his mind and had him survive the TIE crash (yet had his jacket left in the cockpit but was nowhere to be found anywhere near the wreckage . . . somehow). With Carrie's untimely passing, the Resistance leadership has to be passed to someone else, so I think it's fortunate that we had a leadership-building arc for Poe in TLJ.

I get that you're irritated by his carelessness, but that worked well for me. He was an impulsive and reckless pilot who needed to understand the nuances of actual leadership. I still like Poe; he's probably my favorite of the new ST heroes.

As far as Ackbar goes, do we know if the actor who voiced him died during filming? If so, would that have played a role in Ackbar being written off so unceremoniously when the bridge was attacked?

Poe basically...

Sent from the inside of a giant slug in outer space.....

 

[loki2371]

Re: Star Wars: Episode IX - December 20, 2019

Yeah, having it be Ackbar would have been nice. But I think Holdo was created to have the Poe subplot play out. If Poe had defied Ackbar just to end up learning the same lesson, I think it would have made Poe look like an a-hole. With Holdo, her unfamiliarity, and her smugness, we don't resent Poe for defying her and her orders.

True, but Ackbar still could've been around. Holdo could still have been front and center in charge and in command of the over testosterone'd silly boys... While Ackbar was cowering in the background along with Nien Numb looking confused and sucking their thumbs..... Men..

 

[loki2371]

Re: Star Wars: Episode IX - December 20, 2019

However I still find it strange for people to spend so much time on a film they hate.

Sent from the inside of a giant slug in outer space.....

I don't hate it. I'm simply disgusted with it...

TLJ is as seared into my brain as is ANH/ESB. I am haunted by it's visions even after only 1 viewing. I just can't get it out of my head no matter how hard I try. Some things we just can't seem to ever forget, both good and bad. I'ts like walking in on your grandparents having sex. Grandpa banging Grandma doggy style. It does irreparable damage to the psyche forever!!!

How Disney/Kennedy/Johnson took the mostly universally loved and accepted SW franchise and made it such a controversial and hot topic among fans is amazing.... And not in a good way. Johnson's experiment worked all right. He divided the fans for sure. But not in a good and productive way. If it was a one and done movie, we'd all be over it, but the fact they expect us to stick around for more is what bothers me. And knowing I have to turn my back on a franchise I've loved for 40+ years because of one (hopefully) accidental abomination of a movie is tough to swallow. Hopefully future trilogies do indeed go backwards in time instead of forward and I can pretend the ST never existed.

 

[xipotec]

Re: Star Wars: Episode IX - December 20, 2019

I don't hate it. I'm simply disgusted with it...

TLJ is as seared into my brain as is ANH/ESB. I am hunted by it's visions even after only 1 viewing. I just can't get it out of my head no matter how hard I try. Some things we just can't seem to ever forget, both good and bad. I'ts like walking in on your grandparents having sex. Grandpa banging Grandma doggy style. It does irreparable damage to the psyche forever!!!

How Disney/Kennedy/Johnson took the mostly universally loved and accepted SW franchise and made it such a controversial and hot topic among fans is amazing.... And not in a good way. Johnson's experiment worked all right. He divided the fans for sure. But not in a good and productive way. If it was a one and done movie, we'd all be over it, but the fact they expect us to stick around for more is what bothers me. And knowing I have to turn my back on a franchise I've loved for 40+ years because of one (hopefully) accidental abomination of a movie is tough to swallow. Hopefully future trilogies do indeed go backwards in time instead of forward and I can pretend the ST never existed.

Just curious, one viewing only?

I mean I don’t like AOTC but have seen it more than once....




Sent from the inside of a giant slug in outer space.....

 

[ajp4mgs]

Re: Star Wars: Episode IX - December 20, 2019

I don't hate it. I'm simply disgusted with it...

TLJ is as seared into my brain as is ANH/ESB. I am hunted by it's visions even after only 1 viewing. I just can't get it out of my head no matter how hard I try. Some things we just can't seem to ever forget, both good and bad. I'ts like walking in on your grandparents having sex. Grandpa banging Grandma doggy style. It does irreparable damage to the psyche forever!!!

How Disney/Kennedy/Johnson took the mostly universally loved and accepted SW franchise and made it such a controversial and hot topic among fans is amazing.... And not in a good way. Johnson's experiment worked all right. He divided the fans for sure. But not in a good and productive way. If it was a one and done movie, we'd all be over it, but the fact they expect us to stick around for more is what bothers me. And knowing I have to turn my back on a franchise I've loved for 40+ years because of one (hopefully) accidental abomination of a movie is tough to swallow. Hopefully future trilogies do indeed go backwards in time instead of forward and I can pretend the ST never existed.

So . . . I take it you wouldn't be willing to give TLJ a second viewing and another chance?

In all seriousness, I do hate that the movie divided the fans. I wish it hadn't, but what's done is done. I still hold out hope that with time and hindsight, some of the fans who resent TLJ will come to at least tolerate the direction it took. Not likely, I know; but as a longtime SW fan who appreciates TLJ, I'm still going to cling to a shred of hope that more people will get on board with it after the Skywalker Saga ends next December. Some of what happened in TLJ will have a better payoff after Ep9.

 

[a-dev]

Re: Star Wars: Episode IX - December 20, 2019

I can't tolerate the direction TFA took so I guess that made me pretty indifferent to TLJ.

 

[loki2371]

Re: Star Wars: Episode IX - December 20, 2019

Just curious, one viewing only?

I mean I don’t like AOTC but have seen it more than once....




Sent from the inside of a giant slug in outer space.....

Yeah, I just can't bring myself to watch it again. At least in the foreseeable future. I must let the deep wounds and scars heal first...

As those with Netflix are aware it is available to stream, and I still have no desire to see it. I asked my son if he wanted to give it another go, and he said abruptly "NO". Even seeing it on Netflix makes me gag, yet everytime I see RO in the list of movies I want to press play and watch it again..

Maybe some day. IF EPIX turns out well and wins back many fans, maybe. There's just so much more bad than good in TLJ for me. There is literally nothing in it that makes me want to experience it again. Even the Yoda scene made me cringe. Yoda looked terrible to me. The only scene I can think of I'd watch over and over would be Luke on the Falcon and R2 playing the ANH Leia hologram. I think that was the only time during the whole movie I smiled.