Star Wars: Episode IX - THE RISE OF SKYWALKER

[Vault Boy]

Re: Star Wars: Episode IX - December 20, 2019

Me too.





He literally clarifies point blank that the reason he didn't want to view her as a "female lead" is because of the tendency to go crazy by making her a stereotypical "tough woman" which he didn't think would be relatable. Try looking into the full context of his comments and the film itself instead of cherry-picking one isolated click-bait line.

No one ever said she was a Mary Sue.

 

[loki2371]

Re: Star Wars: Episode IX - December 20, 2019

He literally clarifies point blank that the reason he didn't want to view her as a "female lead" is because of the tendency to go crazy by making her a stereotypical "tough woman" which he didn't think would be relatable. Try looking into the full context of his comments and the film itself instead of cherry-picking one isolated click-bait line.

Another reason why Gareth was the perfect director for RO and why it felt more like SW to me than any other Disney SW movie so far. He was an actual fan and understood what made Star Wars into Star Wars. Leia never felt like a forced female power character.

If only JJ and Rian felt the same about Rey, Rose and purple Hair.....

 

[a-dev]

Re: Star Wars: Episode IX - December 20, 2019

No one ever said she was a Mary Sue.

I feel like I have indeed seen her lumped in with Rey as a Mary Sue in youtube videos that I've watched.

This is the problem now. Either everything is racist and everything is sexist or everything is forced diversity and everything is feminist propaganda. We're living in a time of paranoia about these issues coming from both sides - the SJWs and the anti-SJWs. It's tiring.

 

[jye4ever]

Re: Star Wars: Episode IX - December 20, 2019

I feel like I have indeed seen her lumped in with Rey as a Mary Sue in youtube videos that I've watched.

This is the problem now. Either everything is racist and everything is sexist or everything is forced diversity and everything is feminist propaganda. We're living in a time of paranoia about these issues coming from both sides - the SJWs and the anti-SJWs. It's tiring.

BINGO!

Someone give this man a young John Connor.

Ehhhh....by NECA

 

[a-dev]

Re: Star Wars: Episode IX - December 20, 2019

Everyone basically needs to






I'll take those NECA John Connors, thanks. And I need a few more Sarahs.

 

[Khev]

Re: Star Wars: Episode IX - December 20, 2019

Another reason why Gareth was the perfect director for RO and why it felt more like SW to me than any other Disney SW movie so far. He was an actual fan and understood what made Star Wars into Star Wars. Leia never felt like a forced female power character.

If only JJ and Rian felt the same about Rey, Rose and purple Hair.....

Hopefully Bob Iger sticks to his guns and they wait like 3 years after Episode IX before releasing another SW film. They need to sit back and analyze which films united and which films divided the fanbase and what individual directors did to either extinguish or fan the flames both on and off screen. I wish that audiences were more forgiving of TLJ but the way RJ made it personal and lashed out at fans directly guarantees that they'll *never* give it a chance now. And that's on him.

 

[punisher1974]

Re: Star Wars: Episode IX - December 20, 2019

Oh well at least we'll never have to worry about seeing Qi'ra do this:

That's great acting though. I bet that's the same acting she uses in bed.

 

[Khev]

Re: Star Wars: Episode IX - December 20, 2019

That's great acting though. I bet that's the same acting she uses in bed.

"Not tonight honey I have a headache."

"Headache? But you seem perfectly fi--"

*she shakes her head violently then closes her eyes*

"Oh come on!"

 

[punisher1974]

Re: Star Wars: Episode IX - December 20, 2019

Indeed Sir. So "believable" Jar Jar wouldn't have that problem with Rose though with that tongue.

 

[a-dev]

Re: Star Wars: Episode IX - December 20, 2019

The Anita reference was deliberate.

 

[cerealkeller]

Re: Star Wars: Episode IX - December 20, 2019

I feel like I have indeed seen her lumped in with Rey as a Mary Sue in youtube videos that I've watched.

This is the problem now. Either everything is racist and everything is sexist or everything is forced diversity and everything is feminist propaganda. We're living in a time of paranoia about these issues coming from both sides - the SJWs and the anti-SJWs. It's tiring.

Truer words have not been spoken in quite some time.
You get this:

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[cerealkeller]

Re: Star Wars: Episode IX - December 20, 2019

Me too.





He literally clarifies point blank that the reason he didn't want to view her as a "female lead" is because of the tendency to go crazy by making her a stereotypical "tough woman" which he didn't think would be relatable. Try looking into the full context of his comments and the film itself instead of cherry-picking one isolated click-bait line.

Remind me to never ever debate you. I feel like you own every back-and-forth I have seen you in. And you do it without ever losing your cool or being rude (I am completely guilty of that) I am glad it was you who destroyed Vault Boy with respect, and more importantly written out statements by the DIRECTOR and not a video or link to whomever he listens to and follows blindly.

You are a gentleman and a scholar Khev. The world needs more people like you. So have more kids or something.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Rixx]

Re: Star Wars: Episode IX - December 20, 2019

Sooooooooooooooooooooo.......


I hear JJ is trying his hardest to undo the damage of ep8. Good luck to your sir you should've done all 3.
From the spoiler leaks i like what i hear so far, but it's early.

 

[Khev]

Re: Star Wars: Episode IX - December 20, 2019

Remind me to never ever debate you. I feel like you own every back-and-forth I have seen you in. And you do it without ever losing your cool or being rude (I am completely guilty of that) I am glad it was you who destroyed Vault Boy with respect, and more importantly written out statements by the DIRECTOR and not a video or link to whomever he listens to and follows blindly.

You are a gentleman and a scholar Khev. The world needs more people like you. So have more kids or something.

Wow, thanks cerealkeller! That's very high praise.

I hope you never shy away from debating me on anything though, my views are just as biased and opinion-based as anyone else's here and it's just fun to talk about these things. The more the merrier.

 

[YoNoSe]

Re: Star Wars: Episode IX - December 20, 2019

Sooooooooooooooooooooo.......


I hear JJ is trying his hardest to undo the damage of ep8. Good luck to your sir you should've done all 3.
From the spoiler leaks i like what i hear so far, but it's early.

Hopefully JJ can find a way to re-contextualize TLJ.

But if not, I think he’ll at least make a fun movie to Old Yeller this trilogy.

 

[Khev]

Re: Star Wars: Episode IX - December 20, 2019

Hopefully JJ can find a way to re-contextualize TLJ.

But if not, I think he’ll at least make a fun movie to Old Yeller this trilogy.

A couple months back I tried my hand at picturing myself in charge of the story with the task of course correcting while still keeping the events of TLJ as canon. What do you think:

This is what they can do and yes I'm borrowing a bit from Blade Runner:

1. Rey is Luke's daughter raised in the ways of the Force by Luke himself since birth.
2. This makes her stronger in the Force than Ben Solo who became Luke's pupil at a much older age.
3. Ben turned to the Dark Side and slaughtered all the other students except Rey.
4. Fearing for her life Luke used the Force to give her amnesia and replaced her memories with a fake childhood of growing up on Jakku when in reality she was sent there as a fully capable adult and kept under the watchful eye of Luke's trusted ally Max Von Sydow.
5. So that his secret could be kept hidden he not only changed Rey's memories but he erased Kylo Ren's memory of her as well as his own memories of his daughter. Only Max Von Sydow and possibly Leia know the truth. This would not only tie in with Luke closing himself off from the Force in TLJ (and thus not dismissing Rian's film) but it would also play off his failure in ROTJ to adequately hide his thoughts of his relationship to Leia from Vader. Knowing that Rey would be in danger as long as she was in his thoughts caused him to make the ultimate sacrifice and remove all knowledge of his daughter from his own mind. Again going back to Blade Runner when Deckard denied himself any link to his daughter's upbringing it was seen as a noble act of love and sacrifice.
6. Since Kylo Ren and Rey were tapping into her created memories they both wrongly believed that she was raised by nobodies which again was for her protection.

Issues that this would resolve:

1. It would explain why her mind went ape**** in TFA when she touched her father's saber with it being the first object that the two of them interacted with since her exile. Her mind was assaulted with images, some real, some implanted, all at once as her subconscious tried to make sense of what was true and what wasn't.
2. It would completely explain why she's so insanely gifted in using the Force. Her subconscious mind remembers years of training while her conscious mind does not.
3. It could explain why Han was so quick to make her a part of his crew, if she was erased from his mind then maybe a part of him felt a strange connection to her that he couldn't place. Maybe he even showed her and Ben how to fly the Falcon when they were kids (which causes yet more of her skills to be explained.)
4. It would make Snoke's line in TLJ more poetic in that he believed that he "wrongly" assumed that Skywalker would rise to face Kylo Ren when in fact he was correct. He just didn't know that there was another Skywalker which again ties back to themes from the OT up to and including Yoda showing up one last time to make sure that the one remaining Skywalker isn't lost forever.

This could all come to light in Episode IX even bring Luke back as a ghost (with all of his memories of his daughter restored) and worst case scenario have him do an exposition dump a la Ben on Dagobah in ROTJ bringing Rey up to speed on what happened. He can even be one of those fancy new ghosts that can touch living people and give his daughter a big hug, show everyone that he was always an awesome hero and that part of him going to the island to burn everything was an unforeseen byproduct of the "new" fragmented Luke that he became when he purged his own memories.

Maybe say that 5-10 years pass between TLJ and Episode IX and in that time Rey started to lose hope and didn't hone her skills while Kylo used that time to rigorously train and surpass her (in order to make their final confrontation more dramatic and satisfying.)

But after learning the truth from Luke he unlocks the rest of her memories and she gets to face Kylo (who is still stronger even with her memories restored) and kick ass and give ultimate victory to the Good Side once again, with the ghost of Luke beaming with pride and him being the badass with the master plan that came to fruition and once again the hero that everyone always knew him to be.

 

[loki2371]

Re: Star Wars: Episode IX - December 20, 2019

The problem is TLJ cannot be "undone". JJ can try to move past it and fix certain elements, but he can't undo the damage Rian did to the franchise and the characters. He can't fix Luke for those that hated what Rian did to the character, he can't fix Rey & her Mary Sue personage and uber power from TFA to TLJ as Luke still didn't train her and yet she grew even more powerful in a day (sorry, Rey can't be more powerful or potentially more powerful than Anakin, and even Anakin was trained for 10+ years), he can't fix Admiral Ackbar's pointless insignificant background death... SO many thing that can't be "fixed".

He can try to steer the ship back on course, but can't undo the damage from the mines the ship hit due to Rian's lack of vision and incompetence of how Rian handled the SW franchise and it's beloved characters.. The damage is done.

Whether fans can get past said damage is another story. But I'm sure for many it'll be too little too late. Even if EPIX is good, it still can't remove the bitter taste left in the mouth from TLJ. Sorry, but seeing Lando return is pointless as we'll never be able to see him with Han, Luke or Leia. And scenes with Chewie don't cut it, and 3PO & R2 have already been upstaged by BB8 and relegated to background extras. I have no desire to see Lando become pals with Rey, Finn or Poe..

 

[Python]

Re: Star Wars: Episode IX - December 20, 2019

I think trying to fix the trail TLJ left might be a waste of his time and a hindrance to his own movie. If I were him, I'd salvage what I can of the characters, out right ditch the ones that aren't working and just try to make the movie he wants with the understanding that most of the audience will likely forgive a few lose ends and forget that TLJ was even a thing so long as the next movie is actually good fun. I don't think people will even question Luke being alive without too much explanation so long as his character is given a role to justify it. The reason for his apparent death was weak enough to begin with, so his return shouldn't be too hard to justify. Actually let him achieve something and maybe even go out with the bang that Luke Skywalker deserves.....


Rey is beyond Help, JJ is the one who made her a Mary Sue so I'm not expecting huge changes there. But it would be nice to actually see her face defeat and show that she isn't just unbeatable at least....

 

[a-dev]

Re: Star Wars: Episode IX - December 20, 2019

A couple months back I tried my hand at picturing myself in charge of the story with the task of course correcting while still keeping the events of TLJ as canon. What do you think:

It wouldn't solve some of my major reasons of dislike for the ST but that's pretty good. It definitely would solve any issue with MaRey Sue.

 

[Khev]

Re: Star Wars: Episode IX - December 20, 2019

It wouldn't solve some of my major reasons of dislike for the ST but that's pretty good. It definitely would solve any issue with MaRey Sue.

Thanks. I must say I almost couldn't be more surprised that rather than addressing the two greatest criticisms of TFA (that it was an ANH rehash and Rey is a Mary Sue) by going another direction RJ literally doubled down by continuing her lack of training while rehashing ESB and ROTJ. I mean sure I can hand wave that her lesson on the rock was all she needed or that there was additional training off camera but man, he had to know that a good portion of TFA's audience didn't find her to be a credible hero and he certainly didn't make any effort to indulge them.

Abrams said point blank that with TFA they were first going backward so they could go forward but then RJ's definition of going forward is more Walker battles on desolate white planets and throne room showdowns while rebel ships are destroyed outside the window?