Star Wars: Episode IX - THE RISE OF SKYWALKER

[Wor-Gar]

Now all I see is a naked old Obi just wearing a belt and boots.

And a pumpkin.

 

[ajp4mgs]

I agree. In that moment he became more powerful than death itself. If Vader had never imagined that to ever be a possibility then Ben's words were true. It always seemed pretty cut and dry to me.

And when it comes to how impressed Vader would be with the ability to live on after death, the PT sure did put an exclamation point on that. After all, isn't it now assumed that Vader continued to serve Palpatine because he continued to want a way to bring Padme back? It's safe to say that Vader would probably be impressed with Kenobi achieving some form of life after death.

Come to think of it, if I'm remembering right, wasn't Qui Gon the first to pull off being Ghost-y or am I imagining it? If so, why didn't his body vanish?

Technically (as far as "in canon"), Qui-Gon hadn't completed his training for becoming a Force ghost by the time he died in TPM. So, his body wouldn't have disappeared because he hadn't fully learned to make that complete transition. He apparently continued his training in the spiritual realm, though, and eventually learned to take on a ghost form. (Yeah, I know. )

My explanation is because he's non-canon.

 

[ajp4mgs]

You are too literal in your interpretations of this stuff and in so doing overlook the most powerful, core appeal of SW. You keep forgetting - SW is about a dream reality. That's where ghosts DO exist in our world - in the same state of mind that believes in aliens, demons and other supernatural entities and realities. I would guarantee that hundreds of millions of people 100% believe in one of these phenomna and would claim to have direct experience with them. Is that not "real"? Belief (to differing degrees) in this is a key attribute of all human minds. This fact is what makes SW so hauntingly resonant.

I'm very aware of the fantasy backdrop that SW is set against, and that's partly why I see Force ghosts as an extension of Jedi powers. It's space wizards defying death and using their "magic" to interact with the living. To me, they're not in the OT to resonate with our understanding of the lingering connection to lost loved ones. Force ghosts exist (much like lightsabers, telekinesis, and mind control) to demonstrate the extraordinary abilities of Jedi and what they're capable of in their most powerful form. They can even defy death.

And Ben doesn't help Luke blow up the Death Star - he simply asks him to trust his feelings. It's not like suddenly the fighter turns on its own and the computer turns off and Ben's invisible hand launches and guides the torpedo. In Luke's mind, was it really Ben's voice speaking to him, or a powerful sense of connection to Ben's being and teachings - no different to people "connecting" to a dead parent or loved one in a fraught moment (that feels real but everyone including them would doubt it after the fact)?

Kenobi also shows up on Hoth to tell Luke, "you will go to the Dagobah System . . . there you will learn from Yoda." It would be absurd to interpret that as some kind of metaphor for Luke's subconscious awareness (or to his recall of what Ben had taught him) during a "fraught moment" out in the snow. There's no reason to believe that Luke could've identified Dagobah or Yoda at that point. Instead, it was literally an audible message from a visible "ghost" providing new information to Luke. That's not me misinterpreting GL's intent by taking things too literally; it's me taking things literally because that was GL's intent.

The key appeal of Ben's living on for the audience is our collective sense of the supernatural, our experience of it (either directly or through our culture.) Turning it into a superpower beyond that of a ghost as we know it is just pointless, because it goes beyond the point of what the story element's appeal to the audience is. Ben's ghost is like our own father or loved one connecting to us beyond the grave in a heightened moment (was that really his ghost, or did I imagine it to get me through the experience?), it's not some silly learned skill. That's just GL losing the plot years later.

In ESB, Ben's ghost interacts with Yoda too (not just Luke). That undermines the notion that Luke could be seeing Kenobi's ghost merely as a psychological or emotional representation of his mentor. It also departs from the association you describe about loved ones connecting from beyond the grave. The enigmatic Yoda wouldn't be having that sort of family/loved ones experience in ESB for the audience to be able to naturally relate to.

You can (and will) continue to dismiss GL's expansion of the premise in later years, but I think this Force ghost thing is one instance where GL stayed consistent with his intent from OT to PT. If you're willing to overlook evidence like what Khev provided about the annotated screenplay for ROTJ, then nothing I post here has any chance of swaying your opinion. And that's fine; I love reading your opinion and gaining the perspective of your particular insights. I just truly believe that GL intended for Kenobi to become "more powerful than you can possibly imagine" by gaining immortality (as a Force ghost/spirit).

This elevation of force ghosts as a jedi skill (beyond simply as ghostly personal spirit guides to Luke) to me is like force projection - it's deeply problematic because it calls into question why these "powers" weren't used earlier. Why Yoda didn't force project to help save a (surely dead) Luke on Bespin, or as a force ghost help the rebellion in their greatest need in the ROTJ battle. He shows up 35 years later to fell a tree - yippee! Felling an ATST or helping take down the Emperor would have been better.

Same with Ben - if these were POWERS, where the hell was he when those powers were needed? Remember "help me Obi Wan Kenobi"? Why didn't Ben force-project to Alderaan from his hut in ANH to tell them about the plans and Leia, why didn't he as a force ghost directly aid the rebellion in ESB or ROTJ? If these are powers, why don't they manifest to everyone and kick some *ss?

Kenobi ghost: "If you choose to face Vader, you will do it alone. I cannot interfere."

Luke: "I understand."

That's all I needed to know. It's not the filmmaker's obligation to fill in every detail for me as to why these space wizard ghosts can help in certain ways but not others. That's partly how fantasy works; there's often a need for the audience to willfully accept vaguely-established constructs.

Lucas used that bit of dialogue in ESB to basically say, "Hey, I'm setting a rule that these Force ghosts don't get directly involved in solving conflicts in the living world." That's it; there's no need to be more specific than that. The audience can interpret the "why" if we choose to (and I often do), but it really doesn't matter. The implication is clear enough: Force ghosts can't/won't fight your battles. That's good enough.

A similar rule, even if equally vague, was established in TLJ with Force projection. When Kylo tells Rey that the effort to project herself would kill her, that established a key parameter of this new fantasy ability. When Luke goes on to die after projecting himself, it's the culmination of that established parameter. Being more specific in defining the ability would do nothing more than get mired in technicalities when fantasy should require nothing of the sort.

 

[Ropen]

So can the midiclorians be controlled by jedi ghosts?? I wonder if there’s a jedi land they all gather across galaxies


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[TaliBane]

Kenobi also shows up on Hoth to tell Luke, "you will go to the Dagobah System . . . there you will learn from Yoda." It would be absurd to interpret that as some kind of metaphor for Luke's subconscious awareness (or to his recall of what Ben had taught him) during a "fraught moment" out in the snow. There's no reason to believe that Luke could've identified Dagobah or Yoda at that point. Instead, it was literally an audible message from a visible "ghost" providing new information to Luke. That's not me misinterpreting GL's intent by taking things too literally; it's me taking things literally because that was GL's intent.

In ESB, Ben's ghost interacts with Yoda too (not just Luke). That undermines the notion that Luke could be seeing Kenobi's ghost merely as a psychological or emotional representation of his mentor. It also departs from the association you describe about loved ones connecting from beyond the grave. The enigmatic Yoda wouldn't be having that sort of family/loved ones experience in ESB for the audience to be able to naturally relate to.

Sorry, I'm not at all saying that Ben's ghost is simply a manifestation of Luke's mind (like "all in his head") - it's obviously more than that. I'm saying the thematic purpose, what makes it dwell deep in us, is its parallel to our own experience of a deceased loved one/parent that can seem 100% real that gives the force ghost its resonance.

The dream state of our mind connecting to something in a dream reality. We recognize at a deep level the concept of it. Even if it's full of crazy visuals and wild storylines, EVERYTHING in a fantasy story MUST have mirror connection to what we know of the real world. It's what haunts us about these stories.

Wizards living on after death is on the face of it a silly intellectual idea (like a non-LOTR fan flipping through one of the books) until you come to the idea of "ghosts" in our real world, especially of those we loved and wish were still with us - then it clicks, it becomes powerful.

You can (and will) continue to dismiss GL's expansion of the premise in later years, but I think this Force ghost thing is one instance where GL stayed consistent with his intent from OT to PT. If you're willing to overlook evidence like what Khev provided about the annotated screenplay for ROTJ, then nothing I post here has any chance of swaying your opinion. And that's fine; I love reading your opinion and gaining the perspective of your particular insights. I just truly believe that GL intended for Kenobi to become "more powerful than you can possibly imagine" by gaining immortality (as a Force ghost/spirit).


Kenobi ghost: "If you choose to face Vader, you will do it alone. I cannot interfere."

Luke: "I understand."

That's all I needed to know. It's not the filmmaker's obligation to fill in every detail for me as to why these space wizard ghosts can help in certain ways but not others. That's partly how fantasy works; there's often a need for the audience to willfully accept vaguely-established constructs.

Lucas used that bit of dialogue in ESB to basically say, "Hey, I'm setting a rule that these Force ghosts don't get directly involved in solving conflicts in the living world." That's it; there's no need to be more specific than that. The audience can interpret the "why" if we choose to (and I often do), but it really doesn't matter. The implication is clear enough: Force ghosts can't/won't fight your battles. That's good enough.

Absolutely true. The problem though arises when someone comes along to graft onto that successful, deeply resonant idea and takes it in the wrong direction, a direction that not only doesn't work as an extension but causes us to then question the original idea itself. That's really what we are doing here.

We aren't having this conversation because Ben doesn't help Luke as a force ghost - we're having it because Yoda shows up as a force ghost in TLJ, summons lightning and destroys a tree. That to me betrays the central concept. Because the resonant core of the idea - that these ghosts have meaning to us because they are like our deceased loved ones helping us in times of deep trauma - is betrayed by the idea of giving them actual power in the real world.

The point of Ben's "do it alone" is - like a deceased parent - he won't be there with Luke in this because he's going against what Ben has told him. I don't think anyone thought of Ben literally fighting alongside Luke in ESB, like "interfering" by throwing objects at Vader or something.

The point for me is that force ghosts are spirit guides, they give advice and challenge us (morally, spiritually, emotionally,) just as various manifestations of that "wise ghost" idea have existed in all cultures for thousands of years.

They don't and can't summon lightning to destroy huge trees (or other major influences on the real world) because... duh... if they can do it for us, WE DON'T HAVE TO. They pass from being a guide to a protector. From sage to warrior. THIS was the key overstep that was taken, the reason we are having this conversation (and also the muddling of force ghosts, "force texting" and force projection.)

A similar rule, even if equally vague, was established in TLJ with Force projection. When Kylo tells Rey that the effort to project herself would kill her, that established a key parameter of this new fantasy ability. When Luke goes on to die after projecting himself, it's the culmination of that established parameter. Being more specific in defining the ability would do nothing more than get mired in technicalities when fantasy should require nothing of the sort.

Oh, I didn't pick up on that. It was SO very subtle.

The problem with Rey and Kylo's force-texting is that it's so RADICALLY different from what Luke does - and also, they aren't even the ones doing it. Snoke is initiating a group chat using his own bandwidth.

The Rey/Kylo thing is really just a small step beyond the Luke/Vader connection at the end of ESB (just adding the idea of actually seeing them through a sort of hazy portal.) What Luke does with the projection to Crait is SO radically beyond that, that it's laughable to say a rule that RJ conveniently drops in there for us would have any bearing, but yeah - that was the very obvious intention.

 

[ajp4mgs]

We aren't having this conversation because Ben doesn't help Luke as a force ghost - we're having it because Yoda shows up as a force ghost in TLJ, summons lightning and destroys a tree. That to me betrays the central concept. Because the resonant core of the idea - that these ghosts have meaning to us because they are like our deceased loved ones helping us in times of deep trauma - is betrayed by the idea of giving them actual power in the real world.

Fair enough. I'd be lying if I said that I'm perfectly fine with Yoda's ghost summoning lightning. I'm not. It's not a big enough deal to bother me (Luke tossing the lightsaber bothers me WAY more). As most of us do with movies that we largely appreciate a great deal, I forgive the things I object to in TLJ in favor of embracing everything that I love about it.

As far as the Force ghost element, though: if one accepts how Lucas defines them (as I do, and you don't), Force ghosts are the result of a learned Jedi skill. On screen in ROTS, this point becomes indisputable. Therefore, what Yoda does in TLJ has a logical basis. Force ghosts have more than just consciousness; they have a "presence" that is manifested by that Jedi's mastery of the Force. Felling a tree is . . . kinda, sorta acceptable.

Oh, I didn't pick up on that. It was SO very subtle.

The problem with Rey and Kylo's force-texting is that it's so RADICALLY different from what Luke does - and also, they aren't even the ones doing it. Snoke is initiating a group chat using his own bandwidth.

The Rey/Kylo thing is really just a small step beyond the Luke/Vader connection at the end of ESB (just adding the idea of actually seeing them through a sort of hazy portal.) What Luke does with the projection to Crait is SO radically beyond that, that it's laughable to say a rule that RJ conveniently drops in there for us would have any bearing, but yeah - that was the very obvious intention.

Kylo's line about "the effort would kill you" *is* a reference to the type of projection that Luke does. When Kylo is trying to figure out what the hell is going on as he keeps seeing Rey in his environment, his first instinct is that she must be using Force projection (the same type that Luke uses later). When he dismisses that possibility, it's because the effort to project herself that way would kill her.

The Force Skype stuff was . . . well, as Kylo put it: "this is something else." The hint RJ dropped was intended to preface what we would later see happen to Luke. The bit of Kylo dialogue set that lethal consequences rule/parameter. You can criticize the lack of subtlety, but I don't think it needed to be any more subtle or clever. If you Force project yourself, as Rey appeared at first to be doing (and Luke later *did* do), the effort ends up killing you. That keeps it from being a perpetual go-to "cheat" for the Jedi. Simple.

I'm really glad that you recognize the difference between Snoke's Force Skype deal and Luke's projection. Some fans confuse the two as being the same thing when voicing their objections, and it has frustrated me repeatedly. They're actually two entirely different things, and I think you nailed the distinction.

 

[Khev]

We aren't having this conversation because Ben doesn't help Luke as a force ghost - we're having it because Yoda shows up as a force ghost in TLJ, summons lightning and destroys a tree. That to me betrays the central concept. Because the resonant core of the idea - that these ghosts have meaning to us because they are like our deceased loved ones helping us in times of deep trauma - is betrayed by the idea of giving them actual power in the real world.

I disagree that that alone betrays the the OT concept of Force ghosts. There's no hard and fast universal law of ghosts that TLJ betrayed. There are tons of stories and movies where ghosts can interact with the physical world. Mostly horror films of course but not always; Valeria in Conan the Barbarian and Patrick Swayze in Ghost are two obvious examples of good ghosts directly interfering with bad guys to help the good. So Yoda nuking the tree in and of itself isn't a huge deal. Obviously Lucas was toying with such interactions all the way back during the writing of ROTJ.

The problem I see it is having Jedi ghosts interacting with the physical world seemingly without rules or limitations. Yoda doing it 35 years later really begs the question as to why he wasn't doing it all the time. Compared to say Valeria who we can assume simply appeared as a one time thing to fulfill a very specific promise she made in life.

 

[Wor-Gar]

In ROTJ, Yoda ghost could have set Vader on fire and the Emperor, saved the galaxy a lot of loss and death. But nooooooooooooooooo....

What happened to the "I cannot interfere" rule?

 

[ajp4mgs]

In ROTJ, Yoda ghost could have set Vader on fire and the Emperor, saved the galaxy a lot of loss and death. But nooooooooooooooooo....

What happened to the "I cannot interfere" rule?

Do you mean "what happened to the 'I cannot interfere' rule" in terms of Yoda calling lightning onto a tree?

If so, I suppose this would become a matter of semantics regarding what does it mean to "interfere." Was Kenobi already interfering by telling Luke to go to Dagobah for training? Was he interfering by persuading Yoda to train Luke? Or by telling Luke the details about Leia? I don't think any of those things qualify as "interfering" in the way Obi-Wan meant it.

To me, burning down a tree that no longer had any sacred books in it doesn't amount to interfering in that way either. It'd be a bit like objecting if Obi-Wan had cracked the log he sat on. Who cares?

 

[jye4ever]

Man ajp is the real deal, a slayer.

I ain’t poking that with a ten foot stick, let sleeping giants lay lol


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[Khev]

Do you mean "what happened to the 'I cannot interfere' rule" in terms of Yoda calling lightning onto a tree?

If so, I suppose this would become a matter of semantics regarding what does it mean to "interfere." Was Kenobi already interfering by telling Luke to go to Dagobah for training? Was he interfering by persuading Yoda to train Luke? Or by telling Luke the details about Leia? I don't think any of those things qualify as "interfering" in the way Obi-Wan meant it.

To me, burning down a tree that no longer had any sacred books in it doesn't amount to interfering in that way either. It'd be a bit like objecting if Obi-Wan had cracked the log he sat on. Who cares?

 

[a-dev]

Luke cares. Luke always cares.

 

[TaliBane]

Fair enough. I'd be lying if I said that I'm perfectly fine with Yoda's ghost summoning lightning. I'm not. It's not a big enough deal to bother me (Luke tossing the lightsaber bothers me WAY more). As most of us do with movies that we largely appreciate a great deal, I forgive the things I object to in TLJ in favor of embracing everything that I love about it.

Momma always said that in life, we win not by fighting what we hate, but embracing what we love.

As far as the Force ghost element, though: if one accepts how Lucas defines them (as I do, and you don't), Force ghosts are the result of a learned Jedi skill. On screen in ROTS, this point becomes indisputable. Therefore, what Yoda does in TLJ has a logical basis. Force ghosts have more than just consciousness; they have a "presence" that is manifested by that Jedi's mastery of the Force. Felling a tree is . . . kinda, sorta acceptable.

Again, I always have a hard time incorporating PT stuff into this kind of OT lore conversation because so much PT stuff was not only so wrong, but forgettable (seriously, who dwells on midichlorians?.) So very little of it entered the zeitgeist and our collective psyche the way so very much of the OT did.

Kylo's line about "the effort would kill you" *is* a reference to the type of projection that Luke does. When Kylo is trying to figure out what the hell is going on as he keeps seeing Rey in his environment, his first instinct is that she must be using Force projection (the same type that Luke uses later). When he dismisses that possibility, it's because the effort to project herself that way would kill her.

The Force Skype stuff was . . . well, as Kylo put it: "this is something else." The hint RJ dropped was intended to preface what we would later see happen to Luke. The bit of Kylo dialogue set that lethal consequences rule/parameter. You can criticize the lack of subtlety, but I don't think it needed to be any more subtle or clever. If you Force project yourself, as Rey appeared at first to be doing (and Luke later *did* do), the effort ends up killing you. That keeps it from being a perpetual go-to "cheat" for the Jedi. Simple.

It's tricky the way you phrased that.

I've yet to encounter anything that explains how force projection actually works - even the basics. Like can you do it - at all - without dying? Or is the length of the experience that kills you (as Wookiepedia seems to coyly suggest,) and if you do it in shorter bursts you can use it as an actual skill? Did Luke KNOW he was going to die by doing it in TLJ? If so, did he consider other options before committing suicide? Why didn't he do it faster in TLJ to save himself? These are hugely important questions: it's hard to judge Luke's actions without knowing the answers (ie he's a total idiot if the length of experience does indeed kill you).

If this:

"Such an ability, while very powerful, nonetheless had severe consequences when utilized: prolonged use of the ability would result in the user's death." (from Wookiepedia

...is true, then WHY would Luke sit and have a nice long chat with Leia? Like his life is draining way with "prolonged" use, so why do that? Why not tell Leia the plan, get out there to Kylo, do the distracton so people can get away and pooof - he's gone. And STILL ALIVE.

This is what I mean about "rules" for some of this stuff in TLJ - for force projection, there are none that they have been able to concoct that even remotely explain what we see onscreen.

To be clear though - I am NOT saying that force projection couldn't work as a Jedi power, I'm saying as presented in TLJ it's a total muddle that makes it impossible to judge what Luke actually does (in his final act!.)

I'm really glad that you recognize the difference between Snoke's Force Skype deal and Luke's projection. Some fans confuse the two as being the same thing when voicing their objections, and it has frustrated me repeatedly. They're actually two entirely different things, and I think you nailed the distinction.

Yeah, other than some inherent cheese in the scenes ("put on a towel"?) the force texting thing I don't have any great problem with - as I mentioned, it's really no different than Luke/Vader in ESB and more crucially, the cut opening scene of ROTJ.

I disagree that that alone betrays the the OT concept of Force ghosts. There's no hard and fast universal law of ghosts that TLJ betrayed. There are tons of stories and movies where ghosts can interact with the physical world. Mostly horror films of course but not always; Valeria in Conan the Barbarian and Patrick Swayze in Ghost are two obvious examples of good ghosts directly interfering with bad guys to help the good. So Yoda nuking the tree in and of itself isn't a huge deal. Obviously Lucas was toying with such interactions all the way back during the writing of ROTJ.

The problem I see it is having Jedi ghosts interacting with the physical world seemingly without rules or limitations. Yoda doing it 35 years later really begs the question as to why he wasn't doing it all the time. Compared to say Valeria who we can assume simply appeared as a one time thing to fulfill a very specific promise she made in life.

Oh, I have no doubt that ghosts in other movies interact with the physical world, hey: slimer and the hot dogs! It's just there was no precedent for it with force ghosts in the OT, even though there were SO many opportunities where it could (and *SHOULD*) have happened - but didn't. Again, that's six hours of story over three movies shot over a 6 year period.

The problem I see it is having Jedi ghosts interacting with the physical world seemingly without rules or limitations. Yoda doing it 35 years later really begs the question as to why he wasn't doing it all the time. Compared to say Valeria who we can assume simply appeared as a one time thing to fulfill a very specific promise she made in life.

As Wor-gar says - force ghost (or earlier, force projecting) Yoda takes out Palps and Vader and no one has to die!

This is a problem that haunts so much about TLJ: Holdo manuever, force projection, force ghosts destroying stuff. Why did none of this ever happened before. I just don't buy all this "they didn't have a big enough spacecraft" or "nobody ever thought of it before" or "in a thousand generations, no Jedi ever achieved this before" or "there was this book that Luke read (in an OT universe that has no books)- it all feels way too convenient, and in a backhanded way, reduces the OT a bit by making the various OT entities idiots for not either knowing about it or thinking of it. It seems to betray the DESPERATION that permeates the OT.

Do you mean "what happened to the 'I cannot interfere' rule" in terms of Yoda calling lightning onto a tree?

If so, I suppose this would become a matter of semantics regarding what does it mean to "interfere." Was Kenobi already interfering by telling Luke to go to Dagobah for training? Was he interfering by persuading Yoda to train Luke? Or by telling Luke the details about Leia? I don't think any of those things qualify as "interfering" in the way Obi-Wan meant it.

To me, burning down a tree that no longer had any sacred books in it doesn't amount to interfering in that way either. It'd be a bit like objecting if Obi-Wan had cracked the log he sat on. Who cares?

Yeeeahhh... about those sacred books, in the universe where no book has ever been seen, nor pens, nor paper... like there was a pre-OT paper apocalypse? Empire was into saving trees? That's another super-weird TLJ thing. And they are such tiny, unimpressive looking books too. Like the sacred Jedi pamphletts

 

[Khev]

Freaking awesome back and forth ajp and TaliBane.

 

[jye4ever]

While Tali made some great valiant counterpoints I side with ajp over this insidious force ghost debate.

Bottom line...Star Wars needs to die lol


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[Otomofan]

It's all just retcons upon retcons upon retcons.

I stopped having the need to have everything "fit" when I was a kid. Even at 5 years old, I rolled my eyes at the idea that Luke and Leia were brother and sister. If it was painfully obvious to a child that that bit was made up on the fly, think about how easily the rest of the house of cards comes tumbling down once you start to analyze it.

Every film adds more layers of nonsense that contradict what came before. That hyperspace maneuver and the "Force projection as video game move with a life bar" were the most offensive atrocities in TLJ.

Some people enjoy spending hours coming up with theoretical ideas to TRY to cram logic in somehow, but to me that's just a waste of time.

It's a space opera. It's fantasy. It's not supposed to make sense like the real world. Just enjoy it for what it is and don't overthink it.

 

[Wor-Gar]

It's all just retcons upon retcons upon retcons.

True. Eventually the very soul of the thing disappears and it simply becomes 'clay' for any ass to play with. Star Wars IS clay.

Bottom line...Star Wars needs to die

Agreed. If it hasn't already.

At a certain point, you just need to get away from something to appreciate it again. Absence makes the heart grow fonder. Besides the movies, Star Wars was best from about 1988 to 1998 when the movies were long gone and all you had was imagination.

 

[jye4ever]

True. Eventually the very soul of the thing disappears and it simply becomes 'clay' for any ass to play with. Star Wars IS clay.





Agreed. If it hasn't already.

At a certain point, you just need to get away from something to appreciate it again. Absence makes the heart grow fonder. Besides the movies, Star Wars was best from about 1988 to 1998 when the movies were long gone and all you had was imagination.

Ohh i’m afraid the hype will be quite operational when episode 9 arrives.



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[Wor-Gar]

Ohh i’m afraid the hype will be quite operational when episode 9 arrives.

Of course it will be.

But as ajp4mgs would say, perhaps we need to define "hype"?

 

[Khev]

Ohh i’m afraid the hype will be quite operational when episode 9 arrives.

Will it? Or will we be too focused on The Mandalorian and the box art for the entire Infinity Saga, lol.