MARVEL' S Falcon and the Winter Soldier

[jal76]

Hmmmmmm Numbers are numbers.

Now I am not using said numbers to say anything about any race.

I am using numbers to show that the media pushes a narrative. They show one story when it meets its criteria and not the other when it does not.

You cant run around saying systematic racism unless you clear examples of how there are govt made laws in present day society to back up your statement.

I could post links to wrongful shootings by cops on whites but that's too morbid for here. But if I did my reason for dong so would just to be to show that these stories don't get covered accept by local news so you have to do some digging.

I could get into how many times the media gets the story wrong... "hands up dont shoot" never happened and yet I watched newscasters, athletes and celebs hold up their hands in protest. Again for something that didnt happen in a case where the officer was investigated multiple times and found he did nothing wrong.. Still... Media got a movement born out of it. Its great for ratings.



WTF am I getting into al of this..


The Speech sucked at the end of FAWS.. It was not natural and did not come across as a legit complaint from Sam. Nothing about his character except the color of his skin lead me to believe he would have such feelings. It just popped up in the final speech.. A speech that had more issues then just that one comment. It was a poorly done scene. Sam just proved he gets his opinion swayed easily.. Sometimes for the right reasons (Isiah) sometimes for the wrong (Flagsmashers)

In fairness I could post a ton of links from writers, journalists, and other assorted thinkers who would vehemently disagree with all of those pieces.
Numbers are great but whose numbers?
There are think tanks, pollsters, and policy centers that can skew samples and slice data to support one position one day and then use the same raw data to tear it down the next.
By pushing these numbers out here, ironically you are doing exactly what you are criticizing the biased media for doing.
I get that it may shut down the discussion to accuse someone of employing a dog whistle, but by the same token, I could argue that using those ?dog whistles? in the first place has an equally negative effect on the discussion.
It all just comes down to which side of the argument you are on.
With that said, this is all in good fun (spirited debate usually is) but it?s ultimately pointless.
You either believe that implicit bias and systemic racism are real things that exist, or you don?t.
Without that foundation there isn?t anything to build on.
People who lean toward the left side of the political spectrum correctly believe that they do exist, people who lean to the right do not.
There is nothing that I can say to convince you that they are real any more than you can convince me that they are not.
As a result, we may agree on best film of the 1970s or 1980s or best head sculpt likeness from Hot Toys but probably won?t on much of anything else.
Just makes the world less boring I guess.

 

[jye4ever]

Ohhhh so that?s why Bucky walked out on his female date lol

Now that I think about it Bucky sure was eager to go visit Zemo in jail

 

[The Buffinator]

Ohhhh so that?s why Bucky walked out on his female date lol

Now that I think about it Bucky sure was eager to go visit Zemo in jail

No one whispers "freight car" to him quite the same way...

 

[jye4ever]

No one whispers "freight car" to him quite the same way...

Epic post is epic lol

 

[Drawbak]

What did write that was incorrect.

this

Blacks being shot unarmed by racist police is a media driven story and not one by facts.

Police disproportionately kill more Black people. That is an actual fact.

Hell the case of the cop that killed George Floyd... Never once did they mention that racism was behind the officers intent..

It doesn't really matter whether any cop in particular consciously intends to kill a Black person.

That's not the issue. The problem is SYSTEMIC. Police disproportionately kill more Black people.

The Stanford policing Project shows that Black people are pulled over 20 percent more often than whites, they are searched at twice the rate of whites but, white people are more likely to have contraband in the car.
White people own more guns. White people are more likely to resist arrest. And when they do, they're still nowhere near as likely get shot.

And most of these studies are ONLY for police shooting DEATHS. They don't count the people who survive.
(Seriously, they don't count them). They also don't include beating and choking cases like Eric Garner or George Floyd.

Police shootings don't correlate to crime rates, income, drug use, violence, danger, or any other factor.

Just race.

I find most, like all people have different takes, feelings, and experiences and cant be lumped into one group.

I agree.

I hope these posts don't get deleted. I think the show was supposed to start these conversations.

 

[Vortex]

LOL^^^

 

[jye4ever]

 

[Drawbak]

Whoa I see the conversation with Jaws has kept going while I was typing, then eating, then came back to finish.

And will continue long after I'm gone

I'll tap out for my sanity. Stay civil y'all

 

[Spartan Rex]

this


Police disproportionately kill more Black people. That is an actual fact.

It doesn't really matter whether any cop in particular consciously intends to kill a Black person.

That's not the issue. The problem is SYSTEMIC. Police disproportionately kill more Black people.

The Stanford policing Project shows that Black people are pulled over 20 percent more often than whites, they are searched at twice the rate of whites but, white people are more likely to have contraband in the car.
White people own more guns. White people are more likely to resist arrest. And when they do, they're still nowhere near as likely get shot.

And most of these studies are ONLY for police shooting DEATHS. They don't count the people who survive.
(Seriously, they don't count them). They also don't include beating and choking cases like Eric Garner or George Floyd.

Police shootings don't correlate to crime rates, income, drug use, violence, danger, or any other factor.

Just race.



I agree.

I hope these posts don't get deleted. I think the show was supposed to start these conversations.

If only black leaders were as outraged over the black on black crime on any given day in liberal states and cites. But of course there’s no payday in the millions by pursuing that and doesn’t advance the narrative they want and the media is happy to oblige.

 

[JAWS]

In fairness I could post a ton of links from writers, journalists, and other assorted thinkers who would vehemently disagree with all of those pieces.
Numbers are great but whose numbers?
There are think tanks, pollsters, and policy centers that can skew samples and slice data to support one position one day and then use the same raw data to tear it down the next.
By pushing these numbers out here, ironically you are doing exactly what you are criticizing the biased media for doing.
I get that it may shut down the discussion to accuse someone of employing a dog whistle, but by the same token, I could argue that using those ?dog whistles? in the first place has an equally negative effect on the discussion.
It all just comes down to which side of the argument you are on.
With that said, this is all in good fun (spirited debate usually is) but it?s ultimately pointless.
You either believe that implicit bias and systemic racism are real things that exist, or you don?t.
Without that foundation there isn?t anything to build on.
People who lean toward the left side of the political spectrum correctly believe that they do exist, people who lean to the right do not.
There is nothing that I can say to convince you that they are real any more than you can convince me that they are not.
As a result, we may agree on best film of the 1970s or 1980s or best head sculpt likeness from Hot Toys but probably won?t on much of anything else.
Just makes the world less boring I guess.

I see what you did there.

 

[jal76]

If only black leaders were as outraged over the black on black crime on any given day in liberal states and cites. But of course there?s no payday in the millions by pursuing that and doesn?t advance the narrative they want and the media is happy to oblige.

They would be if black people were killing other black people because of the color of their skin.
Why aren?t white leaders more outraged about white on white violence? Those numbers significantly outweigh the black on black numbers.

 

[jal76]

I see what you did there.

Couldn?t resist

 

[JAWS]

this


Police disproportionately kill more Black people. That is an actual fact.



It doesn't really matter whether any cop in particular consciously intends to kill a Black person.

That's not the issue. The problem is SYSTEMIC. Police disproportionately kill more Black people.

The Stanford policing Project shows that Black people are pulled over 20 percent more often than whites, they are searched at twice the rate of whites but, white people are more likely to have contraband in the car.
White people own more guns. White people are more likely to resist arrest. And when they do, they're still nowhere near as likely get shot.

And most of these studies are ONLY for police shooting DEATHS. They don't count the people who survive.
(Seriously, they don't count them). They also don't include beating and choking cases like Eric Garner or George Floyd.

Police shootings don't correlate to crime rates, income, drug use, violence, danger, or any other factor.

Just race.



I agree.

I hope these posts don't get deleted. I think the show was supposed to start these conversations.

Hmmmmmm lots of statements in there that I have never heard before.. A link or two would be nice.. But I guess I can research it on my own.

When you talk about cops disproportionately killing more blacks then you have to ask is that because blacks commit disproportionately more crimes.. I am not say more.. We are taking about proportions here.

So it stands to reason that it might happen. Some other stats like who resists more arrests.. Is that a proportion stat or just hard numbers?

As for pullovers.. Yeah I got issues with that unless police are policing high crime areas.. I know profiling is frowned upon but if there is a serial killer or mass shooter out there I am looking for the white guy So are pull overs done in high crime areas or in general. If pulled over for being black in general like my cousin's husband... Yep thats ****ed up

 

[e30ernest]

Now they may and can still feel that way.. Who am I to say.. Perhaps it was not agenda driven and its how they feel.. I did not walk in their shoes and lived their lives. So fine.. How about this.. Their feelings and the shows writing made for some ****** TV. I was onboard with most of it.. But the speech.. My God the Speech... I can turn on MSNBC any given night and hear the same thing delivered just as badly.

I consider myself a liberal person, but I rolled my eyes and groaned at (new) Captain America's speech. It was silly, naive and poorly thought out.

As someone who would lean more towards the left, I definitely agree that the speech was awful.

As for pullovers.. Yeah I got issues with that unless police are policing high crime areas.. I know profiling is frowned upon but if there is a serial killer or mass shooter out there I am looking for the white guy So are pull overs done in high crime areas or in general. If pulled over for being black in general like my cousin's husband... Yep thats ****ed up

So a bit of an anecdote from my childhood, I was actually raised to fear black people because my (very conservative) parents and their family did think that many of them are prone to crimes. The same goes for Mexicans and Indians. Their belief carries to this day, even if they've toned down somewhat. And the absolute hilarious (or sad thing) about that is they do not think they are racist at all. I think their heavy right bias has made me and my brother, as well as many of our cousins lean left.

And also, of course they watch Fox News and now Newsmaxx and OAN.

 

[punisher1974]

Ohhhh so that?s why Bucky walked out on his female date lol

Now that I think about it Bucky sure was eager to go visit Zemo in jail

Prison sex?

 

[e30ernest]

Prison sex?

Missed opportunity with the Punisher.

 

[jye4ever]

Prison sex?

 

[Khev]

WTF am I getting into al of this..

And lol at jye's screaming Walker soap.

 

[punisher1974]

Damn this thread is hilarious. The bar of soap is a warning showing what happens if you drop it. "Freight Train"

 

[jye4ever]

And lol at jye's screaming Walker soap.

Can’t wait to be lectured about modern socioeconomic disparities by Eternals cosmic beings from over 7 millenniums ago