The Avengers: The Motion Picture Discussion Thread- Open SPOILERS -enter at own risk!

[thenammagazine]

Cap is one of my favorite comic characters and I really liked him in the movie. He was probably my favorite, personally. They did seem to portray him to be a somewhat naive follower. He saw no reason to doubt Nick Fury while Stark and Banner were both skeptical of his intentions. Stark insulted him quite a few times.

In spite of that, I feel like he shined through as a true hero in the movie. He was the one that was level headed and broke up the fight between Thor and Iron man, he took on Loki by himself, he was portrayed rescuing people multiple times during the final fight scene, and Coulson's hero admiration of him was prominently displayed with good reason in my opinion. Some of the things he says like the comment about Thor and Loki being gods as well as the trust and down to earth attitude that he carries when he first meets Bruce Banner on the Heli-Carrier embody values and beliefs that some may dismiss as old fashioned but what I like about him the most. Captain America is awesome.

(Nolancompoopy disclaimer )

I thought that fit perfectly. It further backs my point about them. Cap was part of what America was and didn't understand what it had become. And based on what he'd known, was realistically making naive assumptions about a country that doesn't exist that way anymore. Stark, representing the current America, knew what Fury was up to, knew there were ulterior motives and from what I got, wasn't so much insulting Cap as trying to give him a wake-up call that the past he so desperately clings to is long dead.

It's also one of the reasons why I really want to see Cap address our current state of war and the new enemy. I think that type of situation would help build the character and provide a better wake-up call than Stark did, so he's not running around like an antiquated hero anymore. If the modern audience can't identify with Cap, there's no way Marvel will be able to successfully sell him as the leader of the Avengers.

 

[Khev]

I think RDJ was the main character of the movie. The majority of the film didn't focus on him of course, but he seemed to be the most important Avengers member to me for reasons I've blabbed on about before (to my chagrin). And he really is the reason lots of folks care about this franchise at all (my wife was only interested because he was in it). I think it makes sense to put him foremost on the poster, because that reflects the reality of the importance of the character to the film and his importance in the eyes of moviegoers.

I think Rogers and Stark actually share the top roles. Rogers was introduced first, it was through his eyes that we first saw the team taking action in Germany, and he was the only one in the film to really stand up to Tony.

When Stark smugly made the "billionaire, playboy, genius, philanthopist," comment BW nodded her head in agreement but when Cap ordered the portal to be closed, assumedly stranding Iron Man forever in another dimension she obliged without hesitating. I think there was a real balance of power/main character status that at first leaned toward Tony but by the end swung toward Cap. Even Tony deferred to him prior to that, "Call it Cap."

It would have been cool if the posters reflected more of that dual ownership of the team. RDJ could have been front and center but Cap should have been right there with him, not standing like a dope far off in the background.

 

[Viking Spawn]

@ thenammagazine - You should write for a magazine. I agree with what you're saying about Rogers and Stark's differences and how they also reflect their respective eras (one being dead & gone). And I also agree what you've said about our existing America... As they say, reality bites. Its both sad and true.

 

[noisetrigger]

Agreed. I also think the Avengers script actually played Cap's current situation just about perfectly.

It's just a short time since he took a nearly seven decade nap as a Capsicle. He's awakened in a time that's obviously changed greatly, he's lost everyone he knew and cared for, and feels disconnected and distant from everything. (recall the dialogue when Fury first approaches him in the movie: "trying to get me back in the world, sir?" )

Heck, he doesn't even get what people are talking about when they're joking around most of the time. Expecting to him to step up at that point, and say to the group of people from the current era, "Ok, I'm in charge, here's the plan..." would have been ludicrous, and Whedon knew it.

Instead we have Cap trying to get his bearings, trying to figure out the new world he's confronted with and the rather unusual people populating his corner of it. The flashes of natural leadership are there though, and he rises to the occasion during the Chitauri battle, directing the cops , etc.

We're on a path to the confident, modern day Cap of the comics, we're just not there yet (nor should we be at this point).

This is a very good observation. I especially like the part about the flying monkey and he was so proud that he understood the joke and an alien didn't

I would also like to add that over here in Asia, show them a picture of Chris Evans and they will be like "who is that?" but show them a picture of RDJ and everyone will be "Iron Man!"

 

[My Lord]

Agreed. I also think the Avengers script actually played Cap's current situation just about perfectly.

It's just a short time since he took a nearly seven decade nap as a Capsicle. He's awakened in a time that's obviously changed greatly, he's lost everyone he knew and cared for, and feels disconnected and distant from everything. (recall the dialogue when Fury first approaches him in the movie: "trying to get me back in the world, sir?" )

Heck, he doesn't even get what people are talking about when they're joking around most of the time. Expecting to him to step up at that point, and say to the group of people from the current era, "Ok, I'm in charge, here's the plan..." would have been ludicrous, and Whedon knew it.

Instead we have Cap trying to get his bearings, trying to figure out the new world he's confronted with and the rather unusual people populating his corner of it. The flashes of natural leadership are there though, and he rises to the occasion during the Chitauri battle, directing the cops , etc.

We're on a path to the confident, modern day Cap of the comics, we're just not there yet (nor should we be at this point).

I love the way he has been protrayed thus far in CA: TFA, and The Avengers. Hopefully, those in charge continue to build on his current evolution to be the greatest Avenger.

 

[thenammagazine]

@ thenammagazine - You should write for a magazine. I agree with what you're saying about Rogers and Stark's differences and how they also reflect their respective eras (one being dead & gone). And I also agree what you've said about our existing America... As they say, reality bites. Its both sad and true.

Thanks for the compliments. I actually own one.

 

[The Ween]

Thanks for proving my suspicion about general trolling. That aside....



Um... no. Open that little mind of yours and see it's not from a comic book perspective. Look at it from a financial perspective which is exactly what these film companies are doing. Especially when you're expecting to pull in money internationally. Chris Evans isn't near the draw of Robert Downey Jr. If you expect the movie to appeal to the widest draw possible, you put RDJ front and center.

Hell, I'd argue that coming off of Mission Impossible 4 and the Oscar winning Hurt Locker, Renner's a bigger pull than Evans.

Yup! Dat's my boy!

 

[jye4ever]

Thanks for the compliments. I actually own one.

Swank magazine is yours

 

[Viking Spawn]

Thanks for the compliments. I actually own one.

Ah-HA! You seemed way too knowledgeable and professional to not be affiliated to one! People like you are what make this forum interesting and fun! And I book marked your site too!

 

[thenammagazine]

Ah-HA! You seemed way too knowledgeable and professional to not be affiliated to one! People like you are what make this forum interesting and fun! And I book marked your site too!

I'm actually a big ___hole and despised by a handfull of lowbrows here. True story.

 

[Viking Spawn]

Can't be liked by everyone I suppose. I made a few friends and enemies in my day too! I like you and that's all that matters! So keep up the cool postings!

 

[ExMem-LarjaThwei]

Can't be liked by everyone I suppose. I made a few friends and enemies in my day too! I like you and that's all that matters! So keep up the cool postings!

Give it a week.

 

[GodzillaSpawn]

Shall we leave you two alone?

Nah, all jokes aside though, I feel Avengers is better as a movie than in comic form because it's RDJ as Tony Stark front and center. He's just such a great rendition of the character.

And Renner is certainly a bigger draw than Chris Evans...especially after The Town and MI4.

 

[DarkMagic]

@ thenammagazine - You should write for a magazine. I agree with what you're saying about Rogers and Stark's differences and how they also reflect their respective eras (one being dead & gone). And I also agree what you've said about our existing America... As they say, reality bites. Its both sad and true.

Ah-HA! You seemed way too knowledgeable and professional to not be affiliated to one! People like you are what make this forum interesting and fun! And I book marked your site too!

Can't be liked by everyone I suppose. I made a few friends and enemies in my day too! I like you and that's all that matters! So keep up the cool postings!

Sorry, the compliment is well deserved...it just seems like you are gushing a bit (namsquatting? ) See the thing is, I actually agree with your point that Nam's Cap/Iron Man post provided some strong valid points and interesting discussion of the film. I thought Cap *should* be the leader, as the "original" Avenger and the one with military experience, but Iron Man has more experience with modern threats, and as Nam noted, the modern way of America / politics /the world...so it makes sense, that at least initially, he is the de facto Avengers "leader."

It's just that this post isn't typical, so don't hold your breath for too many more "cool postings" of this type from him. Do you understand the meaning behind his "Nolancompoopy disclaimer"? I hope I am wrong, because it was an interesting read, and something I didn't consciously consider when watching the film, but it does make a lot of sense.

P.S.: Hey Nam, Happy Father's Day!

 

[thenammagazine]

Do you understand the meaning behind his "Nolancompoopy disclaimer"? I hope I am wrong, because it was an interesting read, and something I didn't consciously consider when watching the film, but it does make a lot of sense.

P.S.: Hey Nam, Happy Father's Day!

I guess some clarification is in order. For those not in the know, for years now, Nolancompoops have been fabricating deeper meanings in Nolan's Batman films to somehow make them considerably more than what they are, hyperbolically proclaiming that there's Einstein-level genius there instead of a multitude of paralleling happy accidents. And somehow, if you don't agree with them and their monumental level of polesquatting, you're either a hipster or a hater.

That said, it's not bad to call out little nuances you find in the films (as I did here), but it's entirely absurd to pedistal the director with proclamations of it wholly possessing immeasurable depth by means of the director's intended, intelligent design.

And thanks, DM, you too!

 

[jye4ever]

TDK posseses some very deep life meanings.

Or is it Avengers that does, I always forget.

 

[Viking Spawn]

Sorry, the compliment is well deserved...it just seems like you are gushing a bit (namsquatting? ) See the thing is, I actually agree with your point that Nam's Cap/Iron Man post provided some strong valid points and interesting discussion of the film. I thought Cap *should* be the leader, as the "original" Avenger and the one with military experience, but Iron Man has more experience with modern threats, and as Nam noted, the modern way of America / politics /the world...so it makes sense, that at least initially, he is the de facto Avengers "leader."

It's just that this post isn't typical, so don't hold your breath for too many more "cool postings" of this type from him. Do you understand the meaning behind his "Nolancompoopy disclaimer"? I hope I am wrong, because it was an interesting read, and something I didn't consciously consider when watching the film, but it does make a lot of sense.

P.S.: Hey Nam, Happy Father's Day!

 

[Wor-Gar]

I'm actually a big ___hole and despised by a handfull of lowbrows here.

I like you and that's all that matters!

Awwwww.... Nam has a friend.

 

[intothevoid]

I knew the Nolancompooping and polesquatting would rub off on Nam some day.

 

[thenammagazine]

I knew the Nolancompooping and polesquatting would rub off on Nam some day.

How would it rub off on me, numbnuts?