Vice Presidential Debate Tonight - Biden vs. Palin.... DING, DING, DING

[Bullseye]

I won't disagree with the female vote point, but I don't think McCain has it covered well enough on energy policy. Neither of the presidential candidates have what I believe to be an adequate or realistic plan.

I don't think there is a country out there with an adequate plan but at least everyone is in agreement that we need to get off our dependence of Arab oil.

 

[IrishJedi]

Nonsense. We're a consumer economy that works best when consumers have money. Any company that has to close its doors because of 50¢ an hour was on life support anyway.

Companies don't close their doors due to increase in Minimum Wage. However, because most people who make MW are in the service or retail industries the increased costs are simply passed on to the consumer, which effectively makes it all moot... except that a side-effect is also some damage to consumer confidence due to inflation.

The economy is like its own self-sustained life force and every time the government steps in to try and "fix" or "stimulate" it by force it ultimately just makes the problems worse.

 

[wofford29]

Nonsense. We're a consumer economy that works best when consumers have money. Any company that has to close its doors because of 50¢ an hour was on life support anyway.

You can call it that, but it's simple economics. A higher minimum wage means more job cuts, higher cost of product, and even increases the number of school drop outs and future earning potential of employees.

The vast majority of individuals on minimum wage are still living at home with their parents.

 

[DarkArtist81]

Drill baby drill 08!

Yeah, that is an insane thing to try and do. It won't do enough as fast as we need it, and it just adds to our greenhouse gases. Not to mention what it would do to the environment as a consequence.

 

[bumblebee]

He is hoping to get the horny male vole.

Yea but all of them arent of age to vote.

 

[barbelith]

Neither of the presidential candidates have what I believe to be an adequate or realistic plan.

Amen.

re: domestic drilling. It won't actually produce energy for at least a decade. And does anyone seriously believe it would bring down costs? What US oil company is going to sell cheap to Americans when they can export at heftier market prices? Using up our reserves merely delays the inevitable anyway and when it gets right down to it, what's more prudent - being forced to rely on foreign oil at crunch time or using it now and having our full resources in reserve for when the excrement really hits the fan?

Mind you I think going nuclear would be a disaster. I wonder what would have happened if the Iraq invasion budget had been spent on alternative energy development.

 

[bumblebee]

Yeah, that is an insane thing to try and do. It won't do enough as fast as we need it, and it just adds to our greenhouse gases. Not to mention what it would do to the environment as a consequence.

Drill baby drill people dont seem to care about the enviroment.

 

[DarkArtist81]

You can call it that, but it's simple economics. A higher minimum wage means more job cuts, higher cost of product, and even increases the number of school drop outs and future earning potential of employees.

The problem is, that even with high experience... people still run the chance of ending up on minimum wage. A couple of months ago, I was looking everywhere for a job.. And I am a veteran with a high school diploma, who is also attending college and has worked many diverse jobs..

Yet, I couldn't get anything above minimum wage. There were no jobs to be had.

 

[LChinoz]

Going by the polls and electoral maps, it looks fairly wrapped up in favour of President Obama, 338 to 185 with only NC still a tie. It would thrill me to no end if NC ends up blue.

It'd take a major disaster for McCain to come back from this deficit. Don't want to count the chickens too soon, but looks like America is finally sick of the republican BS. :chew We'll see if the democratic BS works any better.

Looks good now for Obama, no doubt, but his supporters (myself included) MUST get out and not become complacent. To me Obama has been and always will be the underdog in the race.

 

[bumblebee]

Going by the polls and electoral maps, it looks fairly wrapped up in favour of President Obama, 338 to 185 with only NC still a tie. It would thrill me to no end if NC ends up blue.

It'd take a major disaster for McCain to come back from this deficit. Don't want to count the chickens too soon, but looks like America is finally sick of the republican BS. :chew We'll see if the democratic BS works any better.

Same here.

 

[IrishJedi]

Okay, can you guys start trying to debate this stuff without relying on your Democrat or Republican Talking Points? Seriously....

 

[RoboDad]

Don't want to count the chickens too soon, but looks like America is finally sick of the republican BS. :chew We'll see if the democratic BS works any better.

I think Mr Spock said it best:

You may find that having a thing is not so pleasurable as wanting it. It is not logical, but it is often true.

 

[DarkArtist81]

Mind you I think going nuclear would be a disaster. I wonder what would have happened if the Iraq invasion budget had been spent on alternative energy development.

QFT

Well put, I agree 100%. That money could have been used for more important things, such as breaking our dependence on foreign oil... but no, we just had to go to Iraq

 

[wofford29]

The problem is, that even with high experience... people still run the chance of ending up on minimum wage. A couple of months ago, I was looking everywhere for a job.. And I am a veteran with a high school diploma, who is also attending college and has worked many diverse jobs..

Yet, I couldn't get anything above minimum wage. There were no jobs to be had.

That's an unfortunate problem, but would you rather be making more temporarily until you find another job with the end goal of the entire nations economy struggling just so you could make more at the time?

 

[LChinoz]

You know, politicians have always been talking about commiting to switching to other sources of energy other than oil (I think it was first brought up in the 70s) but their voting records say otherwise. Isn't it time we decided to actually do this? I mean, drill baby drill really is not the way to go IMO. And the fact that it is the McPalin slogan scares me.

 

[Entropy]

I think Mr Spock said it best:

*shrugs* It's pretty obvious that the country was doing a hell of a lot better under a Clinton presidency than George Bush.

 

[barbelith]

Higher taxes decreases the desire to invest because you lower the rate of return on investment.

Profit is profit.

It also promotes not only moving the manufacturing side of a company but moving the complete ownership of the company. So the IRS misses out on both taxes on profits AND earnings.

Easy enough to close that loophole. Companies almost always go to the same handful of international locations for tax purposes. This is because most countries have a rational tax policy.

I disagree, it would certainly create disparity between the very poor and the very wealthy, but it will also bolster the true middle class, which has been sliding toward poverty because of the minimum wage.

I'm sure it sounds very convincing when Rush says it.

The economy is like its own self-sustained life force and every time the government steps in to try and "fix" or "stimulate" it by force it ultimately just makes the problems worse.

The economy is currently in crisis mode thanks to being left to its own devices.

A higher minimum wage means more job cuts, higher cost of product, and even increases the number of school drop outs and future earning potential of employees.

It doesn't inherently mean any of these things, of course. And it means nothing at all for any business that pays higher than minimum wage in the first place.

The vast majority of individuals on minimum wage are still living at home with their parents.

How many apartments can you rent on minimum wage?

 

[DarkArtist81]

That's an unfortunate problem, but would you rather be making more temporarily until you find another job with the end goal of the entire nations economy struggling just so you could make more at the time?

Honestly, I believe that if the middle class makes more... we will put more into the pockets of the taxed higher class, spreading the wealth around and having a better minimum wage helps that. When we have more money, we spend, and that will push the economy forward.

On minimum wage I was unable to pay even my most basic bills, and that was working overtime as much as possible. It's simply inadequate with the cost of living in many areas.

 

[barbelith]

That's an unfortunate problem, but would you rather be making more temporarily until you find another job with the end goal of the entire nations economy struggling just so you could make more at the time?

You might have some credibility if the GDP didn't keep rising.

 

[IrishJedi]

The economy is currently in crisis mode thanks to being left to its own devices.

Bull^^^^. It's in a down turn for many reasons, and partly because the government (both Democrats and Republicans) keep politicizing the economy and ^^^^ing with it, which they have for years. It's like a picked scab that can never heal itself.