1/6 1/6 Hot Toys - MMS 452 - Star Wars: Episode V ESB - Darth Vader

[Lord Valefor]

this new Sideshow statue might have the best headsculpt to date, in terms of a general representation of Vader .The face mask (especially the eyes) seem spot on. And the dome shape perfect.

 

[rayeknor]

Nose seems too big, other then that a good anh sculpt. Still prefer esb look and the ht esb Vader as said looks better
In hand vs photos. Still my favorite 1:6 Vader.

Just me or is Kaiyodo mask a bit too long in the face in side profile view? Might be distortion. At least it got the cheeks slanting, which is one of the nitpicks on the esb one.

 

[Vader0706]

For the experts - how movie accurate is this Vader? Is he exactly as he is in the film or there are things changed? If yes, what is different from the film?

I just have a bit of an OCD regarding movie accurateness, hence why asking.

Thank you.

 

[rayeknor]

Oh how much fun you will have here..

If you're looking for a specific movie it gets a bit technical. If you're looking for say episode 4 accuracy, the a new hope hot toys Vader is your man. Are you looking for empire likeness then this Vader is your pick for best out of box likeness.

Then theres the world of customizing and modding the figure to get that extra oomph.

Overall for 1:6 its generally between this or the rogue one Vader as for winch one is the most accurate. If you prefer the ragged, worn almost insect like battle hardened cool Vader from episode IV or rogue one, go for the rogue one Vader. If you prefer the cleaner more black shiny cybernetic look from episode 5 and 6, go for the esb Vader.

 

[TaliBane]

I'll have to get the ruler out and measure them.

That would be great! Thanks again for your comp pics (and fig pics in general) - the Matrix comparison pics are becoming the gold standard aound here.

I’m too lazy to multi quote all the things but I felt like making a few comments.

It’s not just the mouth slant that’s backwards on the kaiyodo mask. The whole mask is a mirror image of the real deal (the cheeks being an obvious example).

The deluxe Sideshow doesn’t have the reveal gap in the tusk tubes because they eliminated the entire front portion of the top tube and it looks awful.

I don’t know what some of y’all are on about the shape of the HT ESB cheeks and eyes being off? They look fine to me. While different, they’re not any more off than the ANH/R1 mask. And in some ways I think they’re better. (See below a comparison to an Efx full size mask, and I’m pretty sure the HT mask below has had the tusks and nose modded, but since we’re talking about cheeks and eyes here that shouldn’t matter)

As for the mouth, when properly lit, it’s really not nearly as wrong as many photos make it appear. I think the ROTJ style fat bottom lip combined with the tusk position really throw off some photos, but in hand (or with favorable lighting conditions) it’s not nearly as bad as some people say.

View attachment 429658

Yeah, to clarify, I modded the nose (made larger/taller) and reset the tusks on my HT ESB helmet, plus other subtle tweaks. Maybe its a quirk of lighting, but some pics I took of it almost look like a full-size helmet that I guess most fans would be happy enough with. So I guess some fundamentals are working on it at least.

I'm right down the middle on this ESB fig's helmet - as I have started doing all the mods to the HT ANH helmets I have, I've started to see all the things that really define Vader, and therefore the various inaccuracies in HT's work people have mentioned. As of now, the HT ESB "feels" more Vader from ESB to me than the HT ANH "feels" like Vader from ANH (the HT ANH fig's helmet really looked nothing like what Vader looks like in ANH to me) so I like the HT ESB better right now - though that might change as I mod the HT ANH sculpt.

Also, the Kaiyodo I'm referring to (the one I have) is a "Hurricane" one, where a member on here fairly heavily modded the Kaiyodo facemask, fixing many of the issues you mention, including subtly resculpting the "cheeks" and mouth. They are great facemask, though I will say the one thing missing on any Kaiyodo or Kaiyodo-based Vader is the high-gloss/smoothness/clean finish for a ESB or ROTJ. They are tough to get up to that level, and HUrricane's facemasks tend to be slightly rough up-close. They work best for ANH. One other issue is most domes don't work for the Kaiyodo, but the Hasbro die-cast dome looks decent, as does the hasbro regular dome (if a touch oversized.)

 

[Vader0706]

Oh how much fun you will have here..

If you're looking for a specific movie it gets a bit technical. If you're looking for say episode 4 accuracy, the a new hope hot toys Vader is your man. Are you looking for empire likeness then this Vader is your pick for best out of box likeness.

Then theres the world of customizing and modding the figure to get that extra oomph.

Overall for 1:6 its generally between this or the rogue one Vader as for winch one is the most accurate. If you prefer the ragged, worn almost insect like battle hardened cool Vader from episode IV or rogue one, go for the rogue one Vader. If you prefer the cleaner more black shiny cybernetic look from episode 5 and 6, go for the esb Vader.

Thanks!

My situation is the following:

I have the RO Vader on the way, but i think he may serve as my "general" Vader to have (considering the tunic under the armor makes him not 100% accurate).

At the same time, i want to have a movie-specific Vader - that will be as movie accurate as possible to a specific SW film. Can the ESB Vader serve that purpose? I've read about issues with the "widow's peak" and tubes not being aligned properly as in ESB - which makes me hesitant whether to get him or not.

I just have an OCD for film accuracy haha. What Vader should i get if i want a Vader that has come out straight of one of the SW films? I don't want to get the Tarkin double-pack Vader as he would look too close to my RO Vader.

I also don't want to mod any of my figures due to my OCD. I want to look at a figure and know it's film specific, straight out of the box.

Would ESB serve the criteria?

 

[hellgrammite00]

I think it would serve the criteria.

If you can't judge for yourself from the pictures, then you won't be able to judge it on a shelf either.

You have all the information you need.

 

[canofhumdingers]

As I mentioned before (in the R1 thread maybe?) there ISNT a perfectly screen accurate out-of-the-box Vader figure. They ALL have issues and inaccuracies. That being said, most people seem to like the Rogue One or ESB figures the best straight out of the box. Both the original and Tarkin two pack ANH Vader figures have very inaccurate black/gunmetal paint patterns on the facemask, and the original has wildly inaccurate chest/shoulder armor (both paint and sculpt) as well as those weird gloves.

Ultimately, if you’re not willing to mod your figure, you’re just going to have to research each available fig’s pros and cons and decide for yourself which one you personally like best. Or you can ignore all the nit picking, pick the one you like, be blissfully unaware of that figure’s shortcomings, and just enjoy an awesome Vader figure on the shelf.

Personally, I have the ESB version and love it. I’m well aware of the inaccuracies it has, but in hand they don’t bother me and I think it looks fantastic. It has wonderful shelf presence and the diorama base really adds to its impressiveness. I think I could be equally happy with the R1 figure, but I missed out on it at retail and I’m not willing to pay aftermarket prices. Personally, the inaccurate paint schemes on the ANH versions would drive me nuts, so they were never a consideration for me. But to each their own.

 

[Vader0706]

Thanks for the info.

I just need to know whether he is mostly accurate to the film as i am not as good of an expert as most of the collectors here.

Hence why i kindly ask if you can tell me what is accurate and what not.

 

[matrix69]

A few more comparisons...

Again the mask is a big let down and not very accurate...
View attachment 429722View attachment 429719


Mask line-up with original screen used stunt mask...again all HT needed to do was tweak the original ANH/R1 mask and it would have been near perfect....
Paint is a let down too...with the gunmetal grey on the mask being way too dark and the two tone work on the left tusk tubing is just lazily done..

View attachment 429721View attachment 429720

 

[canofhumdingers]

It’s so funny how different people can look at the same thing and see things completely differently. I look at your comparisons Matrix and think the HT ESB mask looks quite good. The silver paint in the nose should extend a bit further down. And the tusks are obviously too low. But outside those two issues (one of which, the nose, shouldn’t be a very difficult mod since all it needs is a little paint) I think everything else looks great, and as good or better than the previous HT mask sculpt.

The tusks are the only real issue for me on the ESB version. Unfortunately, I think it’s going to be nearly impossible to fix that. Because, while you can delicately fix the tusk angle if you try (as has been demonstrated), that’s not the only problem. The tusk tubes themselves come out too low at the mouth. As in, where the tusk tubes touch the bottom mouth corners is lower than it should be. The top of the tube is aligned with the bottom of the mouth corner, whereas is should be that the bottom of the tube aligns with the bottom of the mouth corner. Even if you fix the tusk angle, the tubes themselves are still in the wrong spot.

Ultimately you have to decide whether that’s something you can live with. For me, in hand we’re talking about a tiny fraction of a millimeter off, and I personallupy can live with it. I know it’s off, but it’s not enough off to bother me. For others it’s the straw that breaks the camel’s back (much like the inaccurate paint pattern on the ANH figures is to me).

To me, the Rogue One sculpt has the grossly inaccurate mesh behind the teeth and that unsightly nose plug. But it’s certainly a great looking sculpt too. I just don’t see it as being so much drastically better than the ESB sculpt. They both have something minor off about the nose and something more noticeably wrong with the mouth. I think I’d be perfectly happy with either helmet, unmodded. But I’ve got the ESB, so that’s what I’ll stick with. I’d love to have the budget to get both figures and pick which one to keep (or keep both...). But that’s not in the cards.

I do think I might look into painting the sliver nose longer though... that looks like an easy fix that makes a noticeable improvement...

EDIT
I just wanted to point this out, and I really don’t mean to sound like a jerk because I really appreciate all your great photos and comparisons, Matrix.

But the fencing mask is the LAST mask I would look at when trying to judge something for screen accuracy... it’s just way too different from all the normal Vader masks used in filming.

 

[sithocan]

Thanks!

My situation is the following:

I have the RO Vader on the way, but i think he may serve as my "general" Vader to have (considering the tunic under the armor makes him not 100% accurate).

At the same time, i want to have a movie-specific Vader - that will be as movie accurate as possible to a specific SW film. Can the ESB Vader serve that purpose? I've read about issues with the "widow's peak" and tubes not being aligned properly as in ESB - which makes me hesitant whether to get him or not.

I just have an OCD for film accuracy haha. What Vader should i get if i want a Vader that has come out straight of one of the SW films? I don't want to get the Tarkin double-pack Vader as he would look too close to my RO Vader.

I also don't want to mod any of my figures due to my OCD. I want to look at a figure and know it's film specific, straight out of the box.

Would ESB serve the criteria?

You are unaware of the movie versions, you are unaware of figure differences and you claim to be OCD. Pick the one you call perfect Vader visually.

 

[rayeknor]

Looking at the pics and my esb figure, knowing all its nitpicks still see a little 1:6 David Prowse in suit on my shelf. Frankly I think the Esb mask looks closer to its screen version then the anh/r1 does to theirs, especially with the head reveal at the back in place. Unless one of us kidnaps Howard and steals his identity there will never be a perfect Vader in 1:6 unless Di$ney takes the effort to 3D scan screen props and make a high quality figure.

Today its Rogue one if you prefer the ep IV look or this ESB Vader if you prefer the ep V or VI look, unless you want to wait for the 1:4 Rotj version. I think that one will be the closest outside of big statues or 1:1 props.

 

[matrix69]

It’s so funny how different people can look at the same thing and see things completely differently. I look at your comparisons Matrix and think the HT ESB mask looks quite good. The silver paint in the nose should extend a bit further down. And the tusks are obviously too low. But outside those two issues (one of which, the nose, shouldn’t be a very difficult mod since all it needs is a little paint) I think everything else looks great, and as good or better than the previous HT mask sculpt.

The tusks are the only real issue for me on the ESB version. Unfortunately, I think it’s going to be nearly impossible to fix that. Because, while you can delicately fix the tusk angle if you try (as has been demonstrated), that’s not the only problem. The tusk tubes themselves come out too low at the mouth. As in, where the tusk tubes touch the bottom mouth corners is lower than it should be. The top of the tube is aligned with the bottom of the mouth corner, whereas is should be that the bottom of the tube aligns with the bottom of the mouth corner. Even if you fix the tusk angle, the tubes themselves are still in the wrong spot.

Ultimately you have to decide whether that’s something you can live with. For me, in hand we’re talking about a tiny fraction of a millimeter off, and I personallupy can live with it. I know it’s off, but it’s not enough off to bother me. For others it’s the straw that breaks the camel’s back (much like the inaccurate paint pattern on the ANH figures is to me).

To me, the Rogue One sculpt has the grossly inaccurate mesh behind the teeth and that unsightly nose plug. But it’s certainly a great looking sculpt too. I just don’t see it as being so much drastically better than the ESB sculpt. They both have something minor off about the nose and something more noticeably wrong with the mouth. I think I’d be perfectly happy with either helmet, unmodded. But I’ve got the ESB, so that’s what I’ll stick with. I’d love to have the budget to get both figures and pick which one to keep (or keep both...). But that’s not in the cards.

I do think I might look into painting the sliver nose longer though... that looks like an easy fix that makes a noticeable improvement...

EDIT
I just wanted to point this out, and I really don’t mean to sound like a jerk because I really appreciate all your great photos and comparisons, Matrix.

But the fencing mask is the LAST mask I would look at when trying to judge something for screen accuracy... it’s just way too different from all the normal Vader masks used in filming.

It's only my opinion at the end of the day...but the mask is a complete mess and a backwards step...if this were a human likeness the thread would be in melt down...and not in a good way, but vader seems to get an a easy pass(as does fett)...and they shouldn't.
The tusks are bad enough and only one issue...but there's the over scaled mouth with the teeth not sloped enough(as bad as the SS deluxe)....the eyes are also shaped wrongly and have inaccurate bags underneath them(again echos of the awful SS deluxe)....the inaccurate tiny nose(more ROTS than Empire)...the short neck and inaccurate shaped cheeks...and the lack of asymmetry and inaccurate paint apps top the whole mess off.
If this was HT first attempt i'd forgive them in the hope that they'll do better on the next version....but this is their fourth attempt and a big disappointment...
Shorten the neck,widen the chin vent and tweak the nose on the ANH/R1 mask...and you'll have a far more accurate looking Empire vader...which is the route they should have taken...

 

[Wor-Gar]

And a comparison with my custom..

View attachment 429641

Kaiyodo mask is far better scaled. Are those the ilforigno cape and tunic?

 

[Vader0706]

You are unaware of the movie versions, you are unaware of figure differences and you claim to be OCD. Pick the one you call perfect Vader visually.

Oh, i am a huge SW fan and perfectly aware of the film designs.

I am aware ANH Vader is mostly like Rogue One, with the exception of a less shiny armor, less prominent red lenses and not as bulky (not Spencer Wilding in the suit). A more beaten up look, if you want to say.

I am aware the helmet design changes to ESB/ROTJ, with the eyes being more downwards curved in ESB and the dome being placed higher, giving Vader a less "evil" look. The chest plate also changes, with a blue button replacing tge green ine from RO/ANH.

I am aware the ROTJ Vader is almost the same as ESB one.

What i am not aware is all the small details in which the HT figures differ from their respective film designs. I never had a HT figure before, and since one is on the way and a possibility of another, i am being very picky with how i spend my money.

Hence why i ask about accuracy to the films. My "movie accurateness" OCD enhances my nitpickiness with regards to the figures.

I don't know where i left the impression that i am unaware of the film design differences.

Hope that makes it more clear.

 

[Wor-Gar]

Don't forget the 4 switches on the chest box change colors between ANH and ESB... oh and the lights on the belt boxes change shape... oh, and the lines on the gloves go from horizontal to vertical... oh, and the grill on the mask grows... oh, well, nevermind, I'm sure you know all this...

If you don't, I just rocked your OCD!

 

[Vader0706]

Haha, jokes aside, though.

Another question - what HT SW figure is most movie accurate (excluding Vader - other characters too) ?

 

[sithocan]

A person who is aware of design differences -like you are- can recognize inaccuracies by looking at figures. And you asked which one is more accurate. That made me think of you as unaware of differences, which you proved to be wrong.

If you have concern about movie accuracy, stay away from this topic since it only will exacerbate your concerns.

 

[Vader0706]

Okie.

Despite the tubes and widow peak, is the rest like it appears in ESB?

And which Vader would you say appears the most like in his respective films, with the least inaccuracies?