Logan (New Wolverine movie March 3rd 2017)

[PJC618]

I hope I do but man I can't think of a film that didn't grab me emotionally on the first viewing but did so later on. We'll see. I can definitely understand how some of you would think this is the best cbm of all time if you were tearing up multiple times throughout the movie. Feels can cover a multiple of sins ("Kyle Reese take care of my Sarah") or turn an in the park homerun into a grand slam. Without those feels in Logan for me right now it's a triple or in the park homerun.

My head says it's respectable as hell, but my heart just wasn't fully there. I kept waiting for that moment to happen but it just never came which is strange because normally I'm a blubbering mess for anything even remotely father/daughter related. Dafne Keen's age in the movie is even the exact same as my own daughter's but...I don't know.

Maybe if there was more of race to keep him alive, only for it to go south at the last second it would have had more "punch" for me. Like if the kids were scrambling through the jeeps frantically trying to locate another vial of X-24's "juice" while Laura remained at his side just over the hill. She's screaming at them to find it and actually cracks, showing the overwhelming emotion of a real little girl who's about to lose her daddy. Logan realizes that they probably aren't going to reach him and takes her hand, calming her. He finishes his speech just as the kids arrive and inject him but it's too late. Laura loses it, and I probably would have too.

This is pretty spot on. Wolverine is my all time favorite comic character and I wanted to love this movie and connect. I though the movie was great and I enjoyed the hell out of it, but that emotional connection just wasn't there for me in either of the two death scenes. I'm going to see it again because I don't know if it was just the mood I was in or whatever, but it just didn't hit me like I though it would.

 

[Neal136]

The only thing that through me off in the movie was an evil clone. Still good however.

Agreed. I really liked this movie, but I can't say I was a huge fan of X-24.

 

[pturtle]

I teared up watching SS too


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[jye4ever]

I teared up watching SS too


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[DiFabio]

Maybe if there was more of race to keep him alive, only for it to go south at the last second it would have had more "punch" for me. Like if the kids were scrambling through the jeeps frantically trying to locate another vial of X-24's "juice" while Laura remained at his side just over the hill. She's screaming at them to find it and actually cracks, showing the overwhelming emotion of a real little girl who's about to lose her daddy. Logan realizes that they probably aren't going to reach him and takes her hand, calming her. He finishes his speech just as the kids arrive and inject him but it's too late. Laura loses it, and I probably would have too.

Nah, he had to come back on his own. That was the whole point.

Wolverine is a byronic hero, he didn't really care about Laura or anyone at that point. As history shows (going all the way back to Rogue in X1), things don't turn out well for the people Logan get close to and he eventually loses them. Every movie he becomes numb to those around him.

He didn't buy into the romanticism and heroism of the X-Men, he never has. He's always been an outsider, an anti-hero. He makes it clear to Laura and the other children that the comic and that idea of Eden is a fairy tale. So at the end after he disappoints Laura and the children, he has two decisions. Leave and live out the remainder of his pitiful, depressing existence with that money the kids didn't take or ultimately sacrifice himself and be the hero those kids idolize him by going out in a blaze of glory. When they left the following morning and he lets out that sigh of relief, then he immediately see the drones heading to their location, I knew exactly how it would go down.

He needed to show his affection and care for Laura on his own terms. He needed to make that choice and self sacrifice for the ending to be effective. The kids driving around with a dying Logan would have been lame, or rather, lamer than they already are.

 

[SNIKT1950]

Yea but it was a big missed opportunity. They should gone with a brain washed sabertooth or omega red. It would feel a bit more personal. The only thing that through me off in the movie was an evil clone. Still good however.

I disagree. Omega Red and Creed would have been cool but wouldn't have the metaphorical significance of Wolvie fighting himself. Because his true arch-nemesis has always been "the other side". "The animal".

 

[The Clown Prince of Crime]

I wouldn't mind seeing Omega Red in a Deadpool film.

 

[jye4ever]

Nah, he had to come back on his own. That was the whole point.

Wolverine is a byronic hero, he didn't really care about Laura or anyone at that point. As history shows (going all the way back to Rogue in X1), things don't turn out well for the people Logan get close to and he eventually loses them. Every movie he becomes numb to those around him.

He didn't buy into the romanticism and heroism of the X-Men, he never has. He's always been an outsider, an anti-hero. He makes it clear to Laura and the other children that the comic and that idea of Eden is a fairy tale. So at the end after he disappoints Laura and the children, he has two decisions. Leave and live out the remainder of his pitiful, depressing existence with that money the kids didn't take or ultimately sacrifice himself and be the hero those kids idolize him by going out in a blaze of glory. When they left the following morning and he lets out that sigh of relief, then he immediately see the drones heading to their location, I knew exactly how it would go down.

He needed to show his affection and care for Laura on his own terms. He needed to make that choice and self sacrifice for the ending to be effective. The kids driving around with a dying Logan would have been lame, or rather, lamer than they already are.

Holy Crap!

 

[EVILFACE]

Nah, he had to come back on his own. That was the whole point.

Wolverine is a byronic hero, he didn't really care about Laura or anyone at that point. As history shows (going all the way back to Rogue in X1), things don't turn out well for the people Logan get close to and he eventually loses them. Every movie he becomes numb to those around him.

He didn't buy into the romanticism and heroism of the X-Men, he never has. He's always been an outsider, an anti-hero. He makes it clear to Laura and the other children that the comic and that idea of Eden is a fairy tale. So at the end after he disappoints Laura and the children, he has two decisions. Leave and live out the remainder of his pitiful, depressing existence with that money the kids didn't take or ultimately sacrifice himself and be the hero those kids idolize him by going out in a blaze of glory. When they left the following morning and he lets out that sigh of relief, then he immediately see the drones heading to their location, I knew exactly how it would go down.

He needed to show his affection and care for Laura on his own terms. He needed to make that choice and self sacrifice for the ending to be effective. The kids driving around with a dying Logan would have been lame, or rather, lamer than they already are.

What does MCU do?

Introduce some nobody Flash knockoff and in the same movie fill him full of holes. Zero feels given, MCU.

 

[Khev]

So for me it does go much deeper than just about if I got sad or not.

Agreed. You can have very well done scenes of characters dying at the end of great films without needing to tear up (like Boromir in FOTR for instance) but certain movies *need* to go that extra emotional mile IMO. Boromir was a casualty that took place in the context of a broader conflict but all of Logan really did build up to that final moment with Laura and the fact that I *didn't* tear up had me leaving the theater feeling like something was missing.

If you're watching the kid in Old Yeller point the shotgun at the dog with tears streaming down his face and it *doesn't* choke you up then it doesn't matter how good the dialogue, performances, and action were up to that point, the overall movie would have failed to deliver. And that's how I left Logan. While watching the film there where three moments I was braced for; the deaths of Xavier and Logan (because I assumed that both would occur) and the comeuppance of Pierce. Unfortunately I was less than satisfied with all three.

The kids driving around with a dying Logan would have been lame

Not sure your point here since no one suggested otherwise.

 

[Khev]

I disagree. Omega Red and Creed would have been cool but wouldn't have the metaphorical significance of Wolvie fighting himself. Because his true arch-nemesis has always been "the other side". "The animal".

I'm on the side that didn't love X-24 for two reasons; for one it was a bit too cliche for my tastes. Main hero fights slightly more powerful version of himself. We've seen that with Iron Monger, Abomination, Zod, RoboCop and a million other characters. We've even seen Jackman fight Jackman all the way back when Mystique assumed his form in X1. The second reason I didn't love X-24 was that like the Shane reference it was again just too "on the nose" of a metaphor. Such lack of subtlety was unbecoming of a film that was otherwise so nuanced in it's story and performances.

And then the final kicker was that even though they did go the cliched route of a Jackman clone they had to twist the "won't put him in a costume" knife just one last time.

Still though I am actually happy for you guys that the movie did deliver on all those levels. The real test will be karamazov's reaction...

 

[jye4ever]

Agreed. You can have very well done scenes of characters dying at the end of great films without needing to tear up (like Boromir in FOTR for instance) but certain movies *need* to go that extra emotional mile IMO. Boromir was a casualty that took place in the context of a broader conflict but all of Logan really did build up to that final moment with Laura and the fact that I *didn't* tear up had me leaving the theater feeling like something was missing.

If you're watching the kid in Old Yeller point the shotgun at the dog with tears streaming down his face and it *doesn't* choke you up then it doesn't matter how good the dialogue, performances, and action were up to that point, the overall movie would have failed to deliver. And that's how I left Logan. While watching the film there where three moments I was braced for; the deaths of Xavier and Logan (because I assumed that both would occur) and the comeuppance of Pierce. Unfortunately I was less than satisfied with all three.



Not sure your point here since no one suggested otherwise.

I hear ya, that makes sense.

I would definately say that even though I wasn't balling I was still all melancholy over the entire rollercoaster gut punch of a story.

 

[a-dev]

I watched X1 the other night and was reminded that yeah, we've already seen Wolverine VS Wolverine.

Speaking of that though, how the hell does Mystique mimic his adamantium claws?

edit - wait, I just checked the scene on youtube - real wolverine is able to slice through them. That at least makes some sense.

 

[Uncle Bingo]

I'm on the side that didn't love X-24 for two reasons; for one it was a bit too cliche for my tastes. Main hero fights slightly more powerful version of himself. We've seen that with Iron Monger, Abomination, Zod, RoboCop and a million other characters. We've even seen Jackman fight Jackman all the way back when Mystique assumed his form in X1. The second reason I didn't love X-24 was that like the Shane reference it was again just too "on the nose" of a metaphor. Such lack of subtlety was unbecoming of a film that was otherwise so nuanced in it's story and performances.

And then the final kicker was that even though they did go the cliched route of a Jackman clone they had to twist the "won't put him in a costume" knife just one last time.

 

[jye4ever]

I'm on the side that didn't love X-24 for two reasons; for one it was a bit too cliche for my tastes. Main hero fights slightly more powerful version of himself. We've seen that with Iron Monger, Abomination, Zod, RoboCop and a million other characters. We've even seen Jackman fight Jackman all the way back when Mystique assumed his form in X1. The second reason I didn't love X-24 was that like the Shane reference it was again just too "on the nose" of a metaphor. Such lack of subtlety was unbecoming of a film that was otherwise so nuanced in it's story and performances.

And then the final kicker was that even though they did go the cliched route of a Jackman clone they had to twist the "won't put him in a costume" knife just one last time.

Still though I am actually happy for you guys that the movie did deliver on all those levels. The real test will be karamazov's reaction...

Damn khev is doing a hell of a job pulling me away from the light, thank the maker RO bluray is still a month out.

 

[Khev]

I hear ya, that makes sense.

I would definately say that even though I wasn't balling I was still all melancholy over the entire rollercoaster gut punch of a story.

It's funny because I can come here and easily criticize certain aspects of TFA (CG Maz, lack of new ship designs, undermining the win in ROTJ) but then when I watch it I just enjoy it from beginning to end. Whereas Logan left me a bit flat but discussing it here there's just so much to praise.

And then you've got films like RO that are great while you're watching them AND in retrospect amiright?

 

[Khev]

Damn khev is doing a hell of a job pulling me away from the light, thank the maker RO bluray is still a month out.

Nah man I'm not trying to pull you away, just explaining my take on the movie. Keep praising it so that I can get pulled *toward* the light.

 

[jye4ever]

I can't, I have X1 Wolverine fighting Wolverine stuck in my head now!

 

[The Clown Prince of Crime]

I can't, I have X1 Wolverine fighting Wolverine stuck in my head now!

So it came full circle?

 

[SNIKT1950]

I'm on the side that didn't love X-24 for two reasons; for one it was a bit too cliche for my tastes. Main hero fights slightly more powerful version of himself. We've seen that with Iron Monger, Abomination, Zod, RoboCop and a million other characters. We've even seen Jackman fight Jackman all the way back when Mystique assumed his form in X1.

None of those are the same though. Robocop's inner conflict was nothing like Wolverine's. Same goes for Hulk and Superman and Stark and Spidey with Venom, etc.

Wolverine's particular emotional torment is that there's a side of him that lives just underneath the surface which wants to kill and enjoys killing. Creed embraces that side and thinks Wolvie's a fool to suppress it. But for 200 years that's exactly what he did. He only killed when it was absolutely necessary even though in doing so felt more alive than ever.

X-24 was literally everything he knew he could be - personified. It was like looking in the mirror and seeing that great torment realized.

The only character that mildly shares Wolvie's plight is Marv from Sin City. He fears to one day become a psycho killer like the cops and doctors say he will. That's why he takes the pills. Like Wolvie, he's a master killer with a massive sense of honor that keeps him killing heroically and never for villainous reasons.