Media Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain & Ground Zeroes

[J3D1_KN1GHT]

Re: Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain

David did admitted that Kojima always puts the Japanese voices at a higher priority than the English dub, hence why MGS 2&3 had horrible, horrible lip sync and he only met Kojima once during a recording session of MGS4.

But to support your theory there, the biggest blow on how badly they treat the western localizations is how they treated Agness Kaku, the sole translator of MGS2. Seriously, give this a read, you'd be shocked, it's like being kicked in the nuts:

https://www.hardcoregaming101.net/metalgear/agnesskaku.htm

Just reading through it now. Superb read and a damn shame.

 

[Jameson Rook]

Re: Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain

Just reading through it now. Superb read and a damn shame.

It kinda made me uncomfortable reading it. MGS2 is my favorite MGS, but seems like she got the short end of the stick.

 

[Snake Plissken]

Re: Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain

I assume this is why Olga's child is named "him" instead of "her" by Snake in the ending.

 

[Jameson Rook]

Re: Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain

I assume this is why Olga's child is named "him" instead of "her" by Snake in the ending.

Yeah, if I'm not mistaken, the script didn't specify the gender (or perhaps the language didn't). The translator really doesn't have anything to work with. Translating Japanese while making sense in context is a very tough job, much worse if you don't even have access to how Snake/Raiden looked, moved. No art, cutscene, nuthin'. Kojima nor Konami never called to see if she needed help and had a strict list of do's and don'ts.

I've done some translation work before, it's incredibly frustrating when your employer expects you to retain context yet dumps everything on your lap without offering on cleaning up some of that context.

 

[J3D1_KN1GHT]

Re: Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain

It kinda made me uncomfortable reading it. MGS2 is my favorite MGS, but seems like she got the short end of the stick.

Shocking behaviour! Now wheres that punch Hideo smiley thing at?
Thanks for the link.

 

[J3D1_KN1GHT]

Re: Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain

Thing is I never really thought of the game as being flawed apart from the obvious Raiden inclusion I just kind of took it as a kooky story and back then they never really made much sense to me anyway.

As long as I came away thinking I had fun I wasn't even bothered about the story but now I think sometimes a killer story can carry a game or influence the score people give the gameplay based upon the rich plot.


"It's just a game! I mean it's got characters named Liquid and Solid, go outside for a second!''

CLASSIC!

 

[Kelras]

Re: Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain

Jeez. The way the fans and Konami treated that translator is just horrifying. I feel bad for her.

 

[Snake Plissken]

Re: Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain

Well I finished the article for the most part and just stuck to facts about MGS2 and some of Babel.

So this is basically that Konami micromanaged the hell out of poor Agness by giving her next to nothing to work with, and constrained absolutely every word of the script?

This is completely new to me, I never really knew much backstory on MGS2 or MGS in general with the behind the scenes stuff.

How can you give a translator absolutely no material to work from? And she's absolutely right that MGS2 is very talky and sometimes was very hard to even compute what was going on.

So according to the Japanese the Japanese version is superior because it has the true script to it? I doubt that, I doubt that very much.

I love MGS2 despite it's flaws, but all that blame belongs on Kojima and no one else. The last year of his BS has proven he's got a God complex and he believes he's infallible to the gaming world and market with any decision he makes.

I like how Payton throws MGS2 under the bus because of the lost in translation translation. Are you kidding me? The one guy that took part in the destroying of MGS4?

She's spot on sizing up Kojima. I've never made the comparison but he's DEFINITELY trying to be the Japanese Tom Clancy. Kojima is just a gaming director with no military background but tries to write up these elaborate story lines and expects the rest of the world to swallow it like it's even palatable. Sure he can make interesting characters, at least he used to prior to MGS4. But he's a hack. He did try to make MGS2 a Hollywood style blockbuster, but the overly convoluted story went over a lot of gamers heads. Tom Clancy on the other hand was in the CIA and was basically the Jack Ryan character he wrote about.

MGS1 will always be a crowning achievement of his, but it only drops off after that.

That was a good read, it just goes to show that anyone on the hate wagon of MGS V is completely in the right about Kojima's nonsense.

 

[pturtle]

Re: Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain

Metal Gear has changed. It's no longer about cutscenes, forced paths or rations. It's an endless series of open world events, experienced by gamers from machines. Metal Gear, and its consumption of RAM, has become a fox engine machine. Metal Gear has changed. Next-gen tagged gamers carry Next-gen tagged graphics, use Next-gen tagged controllers. Regenerating health inside the game simplify and change their outcomes. Health control. Ego control. Difficulty control. Gameplay control. Everything is Realistic, and kept under control. Metal Gear has changed. The age of paths has become the age of exploring. All in the name of increasing satisfaction from developers of mass marketing. And they who controls the industry, controls innovation. Metal Gear has changed. When the industry is under total control, Metal Gear... becomes routine.

 

[pturtle]

Re: Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain

Rumored release date!!

https://www.examiner.com/article/metal-gear-solid-v-the-phantom-pain-release-date-listed-by-retailer

 

[Jameson Rook]

Re: Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain

Jeez. The way the fans and Konami treated that translator is just horrifying. I feel bad for her.

I feel bad not just for her, but for myself for being such a MGS2 fanboy. Hope she found success far, far away from Konami.

So this is basically that Konami micromanaged the hell out of poor Agness by giving her next to nothing to work with, and constrained absolutely every word of the script?

Yup. And if Kojima/Konami actually cared they would have supervised her, ask her how she's doing, at the very least. Totally contradicts that MGS was aimed at western audiences.

How can you give a translator absolutely no material to work from? And she's absolutely right that MGS2 is very talky and sometimes was very hard to even compute what was going on.

Like I said before I've done some English translation before and I can assure you that you can't. The English language is very intricate and a lot of context from other languages doesn't translate well. I guess that's where "currently existing technology" and "We've managed to avoid drowning" comes from.

So according to the Japanese the Japanese version is superior because it has the true script to it? I doubt that, I doubt that very much.

My cousin studied in Japan for 5 years so I'll be asking her to sit down with me on both versions someday. We'll see.

She's spot on sizing up Kojima. I've never made the comparison but he's DEFINITELY trying to be the Japanese Tom Clancy. Kojima is just a gaming director with no military background but tries to write up these elaborate story lines and expects the rest of the world to swallow it like it's even palatable. Sure he can make interesting characters, at least he used to prior to MGS4. But he's a hack. He did try to make MGS2 a Hollywood style blockbuster, but the overly convoluted story went over a lot of gamers heads. Tom Clancy on the other hand was in the CIA and was basically the Jack Ryan character he wrote about.

I started to notice that when Kojima wrote in PW that Big Boss had respect for Che Guevara, I don't know how that slipped by. You can have your own opinion of Che but at least here in my region, he's a terrorist, a monster. The way BB and Kaz were talking about him painted him as a messiah. Tell that to the families of the innocents he's killed.

MGS1 will always be a crowning achievement of his, but it only drops off after that.

Jeremy Blaustein did MGS1, but he was treated better, but still left Konami bitter. Come to think of it,, what happened to Kojima's best bud Scott Dolph why and isn't he mentioned at all? Hmm.

Anyway, Blaustein interview:
https://www.hardcoregaming101.net/metalgear/jeremyblaustein.htm

 

[Solidus]

Re: Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain

David did admitted that Kojima always puts the Japanese voices at a higher priority than the English dub, hence why MGS 2&3 had horrible, horrible lip sync and he only met Kojima once during a recording session of MGS4.

But to support your theory there, the biggest blow on how badly they treat the western localizations is how they treated Agness Kaku, the sole translator of MGS2. Seriously, give this a read, you'd be shocked, it's like being kicked in the nuts:

https://www.hardcoregaming101.net/metalgear/agnesskaku.htm

Good find, Ryan. I just finished reading it. What an eye opener. Agnes Kaku was right about Kojima. It's odd that a Japanese man would write a story about an American soldier in war. I guess in retrospect, the same thing could be said about MGS V, and the taboo subjects of race that he wants to address.

MGS is an utter mess of a series. It's surprising that so many of us here actually like it, considering that we spend most of our time on SSF just criticizing it and its creator. I think I'm more of a fan of Snake than the series itself.

 

[WellCQCaboutthat]

Re: Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain

right, me too!

 

[Jameson Rook]

Re: Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain

Good find, Ryan. I just finished reading it. What an eye opener. Agnes Kaku was right about Kojima. It's odd that a Japanese man would write a story about an American soldier in war. I guess in retrospect, the same thing could be said about MGS V, and the taboo subjects of race that he wants to address.

MGS is an utter mess of a series. It's surprising that so many of us here actually like it, considering that we spend most of our time on SSF just criticizing it and its creator. I think I'm more of a fan of Snake than the series itself.

I'm waiting to see if there are any MGS fanboys that will attack her on this board. I'm sorry but I totally agree that she has the authority to talk about MGS2's script more so than anyone else.

She mentioned about puns being in the script such as Raiden's "Nerd?". MGS3 had the worst, when the Boss said (regarding the End) "The End is saving whatever life he has left for battle, and when he does, it will be the end for the boy". Sheesh.

 

[Solidus]

Re: Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain

I'm waiting to see if there are any MGS fanboys that will attack her on this board. I'm sorry but I totally agree that she has the authority to talk about MGS2's script more so than anyone else.

She mentioned about puns being in the script such as Raiden's "Nerd?". MGS3 had the worst, when the Boss said (regarding the End) "The End is saving whatever life he has left for battle, and when he does, it will be the end for the boy". Sheesh.

You mean the Kojima band-wagoners on SSF? I'm certain they'll show up; just to tell us why we're so wrong for ever questioning his decision on anything.

Anyway, that line about The End was cheesy. I laughed when they referred to Naked Snake as "the boy". He's a freakin' bearded man in his 30s . Another thing I found weird, was how he fought with the Green Berets for several years, but still asked noob questions like, "but, how do I think like a soldier?". He should have had that figured out already.

 

[Solid_Slug]

Re: Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain

Anyway, that line about The End was cheesy. I laughed when they referred to Naked Snake as "the boy". He's a freakin' bearded man in his 30s . Another thing I found weird, was how he fought with the Green Berets for several years, but still asked noob questions like, "but, how do I think like a soldier?". He should have had that figured out already.

Maybe she was just snide or something. I have been called a boy several times by older go workers etc. There has not been anything malicious about it. It is just how some people talk, like; "What were you boys doing here. Everything ok?" And I'm 32 and bearded. I know that some people don't like it, but it just the way some people talk to others.

BTW: I hate to sound like forum police which I'm obviously not, but this topic is a too full of rage that IMO is not any longer related to MGS V nor phantom pain as such. Maybe some of anger that is justified (like hayter being replaced), but I'm just tired of reading 10 to 30 pages in a row about how much some of you hate BB and Kojima. Actually there is most likely hundreds of pages about just that.
Just a humble suggestion; could you make own "Reasons why I hate Kojima" -topic instead of pouring everything here. Maybe he deserves that, but isn't this topic about those games. I'm still interested the game (games) and all game related news just are lost here. That is why I don't really like to comment or talk about MGS related stuff anymore.

I kind of understand why some of you are so pissed, since I have felt the kind of same after Bay did what he did to TF -movies. Or how they totally *******ed G.I Joe, but even I don't spend pages and pages repeating that, though everyone has right to express their thoughts. But I think that we all know where each of you stand and what you like by now. Thank you.

 

[Solidus]

Re: Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain

Maybe she was just snide or something. I have been called a boy several times by older go workers etc. There has not been anything malicious about it. It is just how some people talk, like; "What were you boys doing here. Everything ok?" And I'm 32 and bearded. I know that some people don't like it, but it just the way some people talk to others.

BTW: I hate to sound like forum police which I'm obviously not, but this topic is a too full of rage that IMO is not any longer related to MGS V nor phantom pain as such. Maybe some of anger that is justified (like hayter being replaced), but I'm just tired of reading 10 to 30 pages in a row about how much some of you hate BB and Kojima. Actually there is most likely hundreds of pages about just that.
Just a humble suggestion; could you make own "Reasons why I hate Kojima" -topic instead of pouring everything here. Maybe he deserves that, but isn't this topic about those games. I'm still interested the game (games) and all game related news just are lost here. That is why I don't really like to comment or talk about MGS related stuff anymore.

I kind of understand why some of you are so pissed, since I have felt the kind of same after Bay did what he did to TF -movies. Or how they totally *******ed G.I Joe, but even I don't spend pages and pages repeating that, though everyone has right to express their thoughts. But I think that we all know where each of you stand and what you like by now. Thank you.

Then perhaps a discussion forum shouldn't be your go-to place for game-related news? This place is full of rage. But, I somehow doubt that you would have taken the time to type that lengthy and concerning reply if the topic was more along the lines of "I love Kojima!", instead.

I don't hate the man, by the way. But, I do question his direction for the series. It just so happens that there's a lot to take issue with, that is related to TPP, if you have even been paying attention to the thread. Things get derailed now and again, but that's normally how discussions tend to go on forums.

Thank you very much for your concern.

Sincerely,

Solidus
MGS Forum Apologist Society.

 

[Snake Plissken]

Re: Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain

Then perhaps a discussion forum shouldn't be your go-to place for game-related news? This place is full of rage. But, I somehow doubt that you would have taken the time to type that lengthy and concerning reply if the topic was more along the lines of "I love Kojima!", instead.

I don't hate the man, by the way. But, I do question his direction for the series. It just so happens that there's a lot to take issue with, that is related to TPP, if you have even been paying attention to the thread.

I for one hate the man

 

[pturtle]

Re: Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain

Maybe she was just snide or something. I have been called a boy several times by older go workers etc. There has not been anything malicious about it. It is just how some people talk, like; "What were you boys doing here. Everything ok?" And I'm 32 and bearded. I know that some people don't like it, but it just the way some people talk to others.

BTW: I hate to sound like forum police which I'm obviously not, but this topic is a too full of rage that IMO is not any longer related to MGS V nor phantom pain as such. Maybe some of anger that is justified (like hayter being replaced), but I'm just tired of reading 10 to 30 pages in a row about how much some of you hate BB and Kojima. Actually there is most likely hundreds of pages about just that.
Just a humble suggestion; could you make own "Reasons why I hate Kojima" -topic instead of pouring everything here. Maybe he deserves that, but isn't this topic about those games. I'm still interested the game (games) and all game related news just are lost here. That is why I don't really like to comment or talk about MGS related stuff anymore.

I kind of understand why some of you are so pissed, since I have felt the kind of same after Bay did what he did to TF -movies. Or how they totally *******ed G.I Joe, but even I don't spend pages and pages repeating that, though everyone has right to express their thoughts. But I think that we all know where each of you stand and what you like by now. Thank you.

 

[Frank Jaeger]

Re: Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain

In the same vein you could just make a thread under this same name but say only positive comments are allowed in this thread because we don't want to hear people slagging off MGS.
It's just a bit cry babyish commenting on the comments of comments

At the moment for the people most frequenting MGS on this forum the overall view is not good hence the mostly unimpressed talk

Maybe the topics will change when it comes out and people have definitively made up there mind or more people who have positives to say will be the majority, but it isn't the case as of now

A discussion is a discussion